US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Early Recruiting

12.6 scholarships spread out over a 50 man roster makes me think a coach would have to be an absolute fool to give one player a 100% "full ride" with athletic money. There will be some other shiny penny in the next class and the class after that and the class after that....

Exactly! Giving a "full ride" to one player out of every class of 8 to 10, does not add up. No matter how I try to work the numbers, even with the "new math" - I cannot do it. Even with round numbers of 40 players on the roster - the top player in each class getting the "full package" - leaves 8.6 packages to be divided up amongst 36 players per year. And to ensure a commitment from each of them (NLI) - you have to give a slice.
The numbers do not add up with the round number of 40 - how does it work with an average roster size of 50?

Not every program will do this, it will be a stretch for a program trying to land a top 25 kid in the nation, there are over 100 programs, so obviously it happens only for select few. Every school will approach this differently and you would be surprised to find out that many entering athletes will take very low offers just to be at a program or certain school, leaving larger sums for #1,2,3 key recruits each year. Recruit 10-12 per year, take care of your top three, the rest may never even see the field.

This is all true but 100 percent full scholarships do happen but it may be 1 or 2 kids in the country. It all depends on the player and the needs of the program. For example a big time school with a new program may need a marque player to help build the image of a program and entice future recruits.

Um NO!

Says the Dad whose got offers for 10%. Be happy you're getting anything, kid will probably never see the field.

I never insulted your little princess, but since you went there I am comfortable saying YOU are full of sh*t. Your whiny punk got nothing, hence your statement about 100% rides. You have no clue about scholarships, because your son is not even being looked at because he sucks. Your statement proves your lack of knowledge on the subject. By the way brainiac, marque is spelled with two e's. Rip up your GED, it's worth as much as your lacrosse knowledge!

This is more of a "general" recruiting question rather than an "early" recruiting question, but any advice from those who have insight would be much appreciated:

My son considers himself a two-way middie, but his defensive skills are far superior IMHO. I have heard that SSDM are an important position to college coaches BUT don't know whether they are specifically looking to recruit those players or whether they only will consider midfielders who can play both? In other words, would specializing in SSDM hurt or help from a recruiting standpoint?

You need therapy ASAP

Will there be a list of College Coaches at the U14 this year? Will they even be evalauating girls at the U14 anymore ?

To your question regarding SSDM's being a 'speciality' position, you are indeed correct, specifically at the Division 1 level. Very seldom will you find a two way midfielder as most coaches want to preserve their middies to either be an offensive middle or a defensive middle. Obviously when they are recruiting, they want to find a player who is capable of playing at both ends of the field in the event that they get caught in transition or another scenario but they will recruit players to serve on role. Also, because it is so competitive, even though a player may have been a stud on the offensive side of the ball, the coach may not think he is good enough to play and if he thinks he is better a defensive compared to the others, the coach will then make him strictly be a SSDM. Lastly, in 2008/2009, they made SSDM for the end of the year All-American honors for the Unterstein brothers at Hofstra. Good question.

THOSE are NOT athletic scholarships - how hard is it for you to comprehend that concept??!

I can't find it now, but there was a quote by the UVA coach a while back where he flat out said he wouldn't consider giving a full athletic scholarship or close to that to any player except maybe the highest rated player in the country provided that he was a position they were weak at.

I've had 3 go through the recruiting process. They were all at different levels. I can tell you that the highest amount of athletic money I have heard of is 80% of total cost. This amounts to about 5-10k out of pocket for the family depending on the school. As a previous poster suggested, these high amounts usually apply to specialists going to a program with need in this position (Goalie, FOGO, Left Attack). That said, a good scholarship is 25% or more, with most good players getting closer to the 25%. Ivy is a good way to go if you are a decent player with a low (under 200k) income. You can do as well as the higher athletic scholarships earners with the grants.

Not my kid but there are some who get "full rides" , or in other words athletic scholarships that cover the full cost of attendance .They are rare but it does happen . I know the girls side more so than the boys and scholarships that range from 50-70 percent of cost of attendance are reserved for top recruits but are not uncommon .

I think people need to ask which school is giving out the "full-ride".
Maybe we need to consider that maybe D's son is at the Naval Academy or West Point. Then we would need to apologize for jumping all over him and thank him for his son's service. If not at a service academy - then - as you were.

Everyone who attends gets a "full ride". In fact, they are paid to attend.

I have never heard of ONE single lacrosse recruit receiving Full ride, not one. And I know many kids who were top 100 recruits.

Except everyone at a service academy is going 100% cost free - most are not athletes, so equating a SA who goes to an academy as getting a "full ride" for athletics is really not accurate.

Not Free. After graduation you owe them your time in service instead of money.

It happens. Just not often.

You mean you get a guaranteed competitive salary job with great benefits. That sounds more like a perk than something owed.

Speculation, can anyone name one current top collegiate player getting a full ride? I keep reading about how it happens without facts.

back to a better topic. the concept of a true two way middie has faded in D1,2 or 3 . the bigger faster and stronger middies are invaluable as ssdm. watch a game and see the almost automatic opposing team goal when a small middie is stuck out there on defensive transition. high school different .

I can. I know of one female player. There might be a few others. Won't name them but know for sure. Was told directly by her coach. It is only second one coach has ever given in a long coaching career. The player is currently at the university playing.

As a non revenue (meaning does not bring + revenue to the school) each team is very limited in the number of lacrosse scholarships it can offer at 12.6. However, many schools have endowments, merit programs, specialty scholarships that are provided for a variety of reasons. I cannot speak for every D1 program but I have spoken to enough to know that it would be unwise for a program to offer one of the limited number of scholarships to one player. With current roster averages, I would think they would almost have to reduce a current players' scholarship to accomplish this. It would make far more sense to find money for a star athlete through one of the other programs at the school. Besides despite the MLL athletic scholarships are not the best type. Other scholarships are not tied to player performance and protect against injury. Speak to coaches early and they will assist in gaining preferential status in applying for other scholarships. In other words, good coaches will "find" money but a full ride bases solely on lacrosse not so much. There are household names in NCAA not getting full rides.

There you go - the UVA coach validated that full rides do exist. They are extremely rare but they do exist for the best of the best and even then it is very rare. I probably would not offer 100% to anyone, but they do exist. I know it for a fact but you are talking about maybe 1 in 1000 D1 players.

You're missing the point - the one-in-a-thousand scenario (which, BTW, is tantamount to "not existing") means that most, if not all, of the posters that make such claims about "full rides" here on BOTC are full of crap! This is absolutely the case because the number of claims of such made. One other clarification is that while the UVA coach said he would consider a full ride under those very rare occasions, he followed that statement up by basically saying that even then he probably wouldn't do it.

I know several womens players on full scholarship.Not going to give names. I haven't heard of any men's.

You can look at it as a perk, but personally I don't want my kid possibly getting shot at. I do how we, appreciate that there are people out there that want to make that potential sacrifice!

I know of a few girls that are on full scholarship right now. Not going to name names as I'm sure they probably would prefer that their teammates not know who they are.

Don't know of any men that got full rides.

I know of a couple boys. It is frowned upon to name the player and his scholarship. It is between the player and coach.

We are talking Top 5 recruits - not Top 100.

I highly doubt even the top 5 recruits were offered full scholarships it is just not the way it works currently. That does not mean that these players are not getting a full ride they must be able to find other ways to fund the education that do not come from the athletic department. It is true that the math makes full scholarships near impossible and hurt the team. Why would any coach do this? A school works around this with academic, financial, merit, alumni, endowment scholarships. Consider this year's top HS player based on the eye ball test from the UA game: Tehoka Nanticoke. He is currently at IMG. Either his parents are extremely wealthy or they offer a scholarship. Albany has money set aside for a variety of reasons, his application is the first submitted and get's the first approval. This is not a violation in any way of NCAA rules. This is how it works. IVY league schools offer zero in Athletic scholarships yet always find the best Lacrosse Players. Good players use LAX to find the other money that is out there.

Finally someone who understands how it works! Coaches can find money in a variety of different places depending on each kids specific situation

I am not sure how this whole scholarship thing works but from what I can understand here is what I think.

The 12.6 is based on tuition not the cost of college like football and basketball where the student/athlete gets the full cost of college (tuition, room and board and books) . So even if a lax player got a "full Ride" it would be full tuition.

So a school with a $40,000 tuition and is fully funded would have $504,000 to spend for the entire team per year (based on a 5 year average) so they can go over one year but they have to go under another year to keep the rolling 5 year average at 12.6 x Tuition.

The three types of money available to most students are academic, athletic and need based (besides the various scholarships available) you can combine athletic and academic or need based and academic but you can not combine need based with athletic money.

Depending on the school you can have anywhere from 60 to 90% of all students receiving some money (need or academic or both) and I know of many D1 lacrosse players getting "Full Rides" and what I always took that to mean is that when you add the athletic money and the academic money you get close to equal the amount of tuition. They still have room and board and books that could be around $15,000 depending on the school.

If a lax kid was getting a full cost of college scholarship then it would count almost 1 1/2 of the 12.6 not 1 of the 12.6

The academies are not scholarship by any stretch of the imagination, the cost of going to West Point or Annapolis is far greater then the monetary cost of a non academy.

I would not be shocked if some of my points area off but I think I have the gist of it correct, please correct if I misspoke

That kid lives on a reservation and has no gpa and is dirt poor. But what a baller! Of course, they found a way....its called life. Exceptions are made for the special people!

My son was ranked #1 at his position and got 60% athletic at an ACC

There have been people who have received a 'Full' Athletic Scholarship but those are very rare considering that IF a D1 program is fully funded with 12.6 scholarships (because not every D1 school like Villanova, Providence, etc.) they need to allocate those scholarships to a 4 year recruiting class with 8-12 recruits per year so in a perfect world, they would give quarter scholarships to 12 players per year which is equivalent to 3 full scholarships per year which would be almost the full 12.6 allowed in the 4 year period. But back to you saying that you NEVER heard of anyone receiving a full athletic scholarship including room and board, books, etc., you are incorrect. Contingent on a schools situation such as say Utah this year, they may very well need to offer a full scholarship to persuade a 2X All-American being recruited by every top 20 D1 school to attend Utah and that is precisely what happened to me when I was recruited by St John's in 2004. But I also have friends who went to Hopkins and Duke who received full scholarships and even paid for one of my friends, now a D1 Assistant Coach 5th year graduate degree because he was the best player in the country and helped Hopkins win a National Championship so they do exist but very rare so those out there, don't bet the house on your son getting a 'full boat' as they call it but anything is possible. Thought I would share that with you.

Again, no one can even name a school! I know a player who plays at a school who gets a full ride. What school? When I say too 100, there are Top 5 recruits in there. Again, not ONE got a full ride. These are players at UVA, PSU, and UNC. Not one of these players got close to a full ride. Closer to 30-40%