Use this thread to discuss lacrosse for the Girls 2021-11th Grade Fall 2019/Summer 2020 season.

What will the recruiting be like come September 1st? Will the verbal commitments given still hold up or are they in jeopardy?

Until something is signed, everything is at risk

That cuts both ways.

How many girls have committed to a service academy since 7/1?

What do you mean by a service academy?

Is there a central location I can look for showcases and prospect days?
Thanks

Do most 2021's have an idea about who is going to be calling them on September 1st or is everyone just completely in the dark?

Naval Academy, West Point, Air Force, etc.

You can find most of the Men's & Women's College Lacrosse Prospect Days and Showcases right here on Back Of The Cage by clicking on this link:
Back Of The Cage Event Directory (College Lacrosse Prospect Days + Showcases)

Service Academy's can make offers starting 7/1. The only one that usually doesn't is Coast Guard Academy. They are Div 3 and their admissions is much more of a crapshoot.

I’ve heard of 2 verbals to Navy.

Excellent service and free resource

Tick, Tock, Tick, Tock.................................................September 1

Sept 1 is the start not the finish. Relax. It's not a race.

Since the end of the club season, I have seen, on social media, girls (very good players) taking "visits" to various D1 schools. I am curious how this works. I did not think there could be any contact between the programs and the prospects until 9/1. I am not talking about Army, Navy, etc.

You can visit schools anytime you want. Just cant talk to the coaches. There's more to picking a school than just lacrosse.

Experience with recruiting platforms and actual interest - what has been your experience? Connectlax, Sports Recruits. Daughter being told interest from several schools that don’t even open her emails. Do coaches REALLY use these sites? Should she just send her last pre 9/1 emails from her personal email ?

In our experience going through the recruiting process more than once... contact went through the club director / coach and then directly to my kids.

Players will know where they stand during the recruiting process. Remember, the recruiting process is fluid and where a player stands one day will likely change the next day.

There are tours of facilities, fields, etc and assuming meetings with coaches and, assistants. Not the same as a visit a non athlete takes.

Right. But can’t do any of that until Sunday. Question was about girls posting visits on social media in last few weeks. None of those things happened on those visits.

Perfect response. Too many people forget that lacrosse is for 4 years (or less) and education is for a lifetime.

Exactly. At this point the girls should have heard from quite a few schools that are interested. Sure there will be more that call starting Sunday, but why not go check out some of the ones you know are? Seems like a positive use of time in the few weeks they actually don't play sports.

Mass emails began at 12:01...it's all about how many kids they can get to the camp, it's not about recruiting! sad what is has become.

What are you talking about? You seriously think coaches of top programs woke up today more interested in how many players they can lure to camps rather than connecting with their top 2021 recruits? Players that schools are most interested in will get phone calls. If your daughter gets a mass email from a school she is interested in, the smart first step is to reply and request a call with the coach. A mass email does not mean a school is actively recruiting a player, but a conversation with a coach allows you to get a feel for the school's interest and if they actually know something about your player vs. just an email address on a distribution list. Be smart and realistic, not an ignorant, whiny victim. My guess is that top schools are moving forward with 2021s quickly, while mid to lower programs will move more slowly. If you daughter is not a top recruit, it may take longer to confirm genuine interest with one on one conversations with coaches.

Head coaches contact the players they want and the coach will be very direct in making sure that the player understands just how much the coach want the player to be a part of their program.

Agree.

All of the coaches have their lists in order and they will go after the players at the top of their lists. As coaches lose their top recruits they will go down their list. The Top Programs will have much smaller lists than the rest of the programs. Coaches will re-evaluate once the dust settles and the majority of top players are off the board. The process is very fluid therefore where a player is on a coaches list can change from day to day as other players commit. Enjoy the ride and remember the saying when one door closes another door opens.

The top 20 schools are all going after the same players the 1%. After all of those kids are gone they fill in. So if your daughter was contacted via a phone call, or email or coach at your front door at 12:01 then you know your daughter is a top recruit.

Anyone know if Colorado, Stanford, USC are making calls, offering visits? Anyone want to share what schools are moving quickly?

My daughter received 6 or 7 emails for camps/clincs from schools she has never contacted or shown interest in. And yes some, while not top 10 are definitely sought after schools.

Yes.


Programs go after the players that they have ranked highest and then it becomes a trickle down. After the top players commit coaches then move on two the next tier player. For the most part coaches know how many players they are going to bring in and they have their list prioritized. Coaches try to fill their spots with the players they have at the top of their list. When the players they want are not available they move down their list. If a coach is talking to your daughter but not offering her a spot it is most likely because the coach has other players ranked above your daughter. Coaches know what they like, want and need and they will be very direct and forthcoming when offering a spot, they do not wait or hesitate with priority recruits.

Everyone must be too engaged with recruiting to complain about the Inside Lacrosse too 40 2021 list.

Like someone said earlier, the lists that matter are kept by the coaches. Some of the girls named will have their pick of top 10 schools with scholarship money, some will be lucky for a spot on a top 25 team with more than book money.

Some very good players but the rest are the usual, who you know, where you pay etc players.

Yes, the lists that matter are the lists that the college coaches keep. However, I would be willing to bet that most college coaches have the players named by Inside Lacrosse pretty high on their own lists. I

This is a watch list. It does have 40 players to watch that “may” end up on the final list, but it is just the start of the process. Many will stay in the mix, many will not.

What "final list"?

I agree that 12:01am on 9/1 is not the best time to send an impersonal mass email about a camp/clinic. It appears disingenuous when blended in with real, personal texts, calls and emails from coaches that are genuinely interested. My daughter's reaction was to delete the "dear prospective student athlete" emails about camps and clinics immediately.

Leave it to John Sung to send a camp email at 12:30am on 9/1 sent from his email account! That guy is everything that I wouldn't want in a coach for my daughter. Bringing in way too many girls every year and promising them the world while giving little money is not anything I would want my daughter to be a part of. Especially considering his mixed results on the field. Good luck to anyone that buys what he's selling.

I admit - did not think of it from that perspective. I thought the original poster was suggesting coaches are sending mass emails to drum up interest in camps/clinics instead of focusing on contacting their top picks on Sept 1. I agree, sending misleading mass emails on Sept 1 to unsuspecting players/parents to get them to attend camps and clinics is not the right approach. My daughter received some emails that were initially unclear if they were sent to a large group or specific interest, and they turned out to be genuine interest. When in doubt, if your daughter is interested in the program, it doesn't hurt to reply and see what kind of response she gets.

Inside Lacrosse release their comprehensive recruiting issue early next week. They usually have a top 100 ranked in order, more than the 40 that were pre-released. I disagree that any will be dropped from the final 100, ranking tbd.

I don't believe IL is ranking junior girls this year. The article that is on IL now is the same list that will be in the recruiting issue without rankings. Not sure why they decided not to rank the 2021 girls when they did the boys.

Full recruiting issue is available online. No rankings for 2021 girls

In the past, Inside Lacrosse has ranked the Top 30 and then they changed to the Top 40 girls (Young Gun Junior & Senior Rankings) the junior listing may have only been Top 30. In addition to the Top Players they have also in the past put out a "Watch List" and or an "On the Rise List" at each grade level. From year to year (junior to senior year) there is usually some movement but not too much. IL also Ranks the College Freshmen (Power 100) in the past they rank the Top 50 players and then list the "Watch List" or "on the rise" players. IMHO Inside Lacrosse does a very good job especially with respect to the Top 30 - 40 Players.
Congratulations to all who are recognized.

Likely because the college coaches don't want to brag about players that have not verbally committed to their programs yet. They want to keep having conversations with the players so they can fill their pockets (prospect days). Adults would ask too many questions coaches don't want to answer. Brilliant....or collusion or both??

Not sure what post you are responding to but I have been through the recruiting process a few times and the coaches were always very direct and answered all questions. I will admit that some do not like delivering bad news you do have to read between the lines.

From our experience:

* When a player is at the top of a coaches list the coach will tell player and parents and they will offer a spot. Coaches do not hesitate with players they want.

* When a coach has little or no interest in a player they will either tell them straight out or they will go silent. No returned calls, emails, texts etc...

* When a coach is communicating with a player but not offering a spot it is most likely because they have other players ranked higher and are waiting to see if they get them.

This system is far from perfect. My daughter is very fortunate to have heard from several schools this week. However, she did not hear from any of the schools she is most interested in. She is trying to be honest with the schools that have reached out but does not want to say no in case something comes together from one of her tops. Once the top 20 schools finish going through the top 100-150 girls and realize that they will still have many holes to fill, I assume they will contact the rest. I am starting to wish there was a contact period starting Sept 1 and an offer period after the fall tournaments were over. If she is forced to respond to the schools that have reached out, says no to all of them, and nothing materializes from her tops, she will be crushed. I was hoping this would be easier.

The best advice I've read recently is that Sept 1 is the start of the process, not the finish line. Coaches understand that players are considering multiple options, just like players need to understand coaches are considering multiple options. Are the programs that contacted your daughter similar in ranking to the schools she is most interested in that did not reach out? If so, I would suggest pursuing the options she likes best that reached out in addition to continuing to try to get on the other schools' radar. If not, she probably needs to reevaluate expectations. Your daughter can take time to explore options without telling coaches a hard yes/no within a week of Sept 1. Schedule phone calls, schedule a few visits this fall with the interested schools that most interest her. In the meantime, continue reaching out to other schools she didn't hear from and maybe things will change in a month or two if getting a spot at those schools is realistic. Good luck and hope you daughter ends up with some offers she is happy with.

Agreed

Agree, and sound advise. Make sure that your daughter is persistent without becoming a pest. Make sure the entire coaching staff at each of the schools she would really like to attend knows that she really would love to be a part of their program. Also, unless she really has no interest she should be talking with the schools that have expressed interest in her.

There will be several waves of girls committing and after each wave when dust settles the coaches re-evaluate and see what players are still available. Right now, 'especially at the Top Programs" coaches are going after the players they have ranked the highest. As players commit and coaches realize that they lost the recruit the coach has to move on. No school gets all of the players they want.

Thank you. Her list was likely too ambitious and she is trying to put a list of prospect days to go to this fall. The biggest issue with the schools that contacted her is that they are not schools she go to without sports.

Maybe too ambitious maybe not. The sands are constantly shifting and coaches have to keep revising their lists. That said, the recruiting process does tend to put things in perspective and really does let parents and players know where the player stands. Remember, recruiting does not take place in a vacuum, the decisions that other recruits make can affect your daughter. If one of your daughters dream schools has a hard time nailing down their top recruits the coach will have to shift focus to a new group of potential recruits. Make sure that every coach on the coaching staff knows just how much your daughter wants attend the university and be a part of their program (but don't become annoying). I would agree that your daughter should identify some other schools to pursue but pursue them in addition to her current dream schools.

I realize that we are only two weeks in but I am finding that the schools that claim to recruit from their camps are not really following through. My daughter and her friends are getting as much interest from schools they never reached out to compared to schools they contacted and where they attended events. This is not limited to lower ranked and obscure schools. Girls that never expressed interest in top 5-10 programs are hearing from them.

My family still has a long time to go until we get to this point but this is the most genuine thread on this board in ages. Thanks for your advice everyone!

My experience going through the process with a 2020 is that don't read too much into camp invites. Most are money grabs and are sent out in bulk to players. If a coach is interested, especially with the Sept 1 emails, they will ask for a phone call with your daughter or a specific invite to a Fall Play Day/Overnight visits. I do think Prospect Days were helpful. My daughter selected several schools she was interested in and attended their Prospect Days with interest and offers from each. If your daughter is not committed by November, Presidents Cup is a great Showcase for recruitment. Coach's will come out to see your daughter play if she emails coaches her schedule and they have a need at the position. Good Luck!

I see a few girls are starting to commit, that should start to get things moving. When a highly recruited player commits, 30-40 schools that were hopeful, all cross them off their list and 30-40 spots open up. That’s a huge trickle down effect from one player taken off the board, then apply that to 5 players, 10 players..... Coaches will hold out on offers that they put out on the first wave players as long as they can, but once the ball gets rolling, the whole process will open up greatly.

I think 30-40 schools is a bit aggressive, but we get your point...stay proactive.

I agree, 30-40 schools is a bit aggressive. Most of the top players will narrow it down to 3 - 5 schools. For the most part the top 30 - 40 players will be aggressively recruited by the top 10 - 20 programs. Not that all the other programs will not recruit the top players but what I have seen over the years is that the large majority of top players choose to go to the top programs.

If a school is talking to your daughter but not offering a spot it is most likely because the coaches have other players ranked higher than your daughter. This is not a random process, the coaches know how many spots they are trying to fill and they know what their priorities are Goalie, Lefty, defensive player etc... but for the most part the top programs are looking for the best athletes. Where a coach ranks your daughter on their list today can and will change tomorrow. Every time a player commits the other coaches have to move on to new players.

Yes - this!!! My daughter is a 2020 who committed before the rule change, but also familiar with friends who went through the Sept 1 contact and recruiting phase. In both scenarios, they all had interest and offers from schools where they never attended camp prior to a coach contacting them. Personally, I'd say the the best exposure my daughter got was playing recruiting tournaments. She plays for a good, but not great, club team that was often matched up against good teams but not the best of the best like top M&D and YJ teams. Still received unsolicited interest including from top 20 programs. Coaches do often like to see players at one of their camps or prospect clinics before making an offer, and those are worth attending if you know your daughter is being recruited (established by a phone call or specific invite for clinic/overnight visit, not a general "come to our camp" email) because she'll be placed in the group coaches are evaluating and watching the most. Keep in mind that more players are brought in than spots available, and calls and an overnight visit do not always result in an offer, but it is a better starting point than registering for as many camps as you can possibly cram into a summer. That sounds exhausting and expensive.

Just as the players have their top 5 schools and top 10 schools, the coaches have their top tier list, second tier list etc... And just as players will string along their fall back schools while trying to strike a deal with their top choices, the coaches do the same exact thing, stringing along interest of second and third tier kids while they try to land the top tier. It is a safety dance where players both win some and lose some and coaches win some and lose some.

. The same way some kids are not realistic, some coaches are not. And many coaches using this for a money making machine!

Please tell us what you are talking about when you say:

"The same way some kids are not realistic, some coaches are not. And many coaches using this for a money making machine!"

How are coaches not realistic?

I detest this whole process!!!! It's a lot of pressure on these girls!! I agree with an earlier post. There should be a blackout period of making offers. If September 1st is the start, how can we give our girls an opportunity to breathe and take the time to go to prospect clinics, official visits, really get to talk and communicate with the coaches and deal with offers all at once? They started their JR year, most play other sports, SAT prep classes etc. Hearing from schools that weren't on their lists that they have to get familiar with. Not enough hours in the day...

Some coaches are unrealistic that top girls will come to their program. This weekend will be the end of the 3rd week for the top girls to have taken visits. They will start committing soon and that will start to open spots at schools as they miss out.

For the most part coaches are allowing girls time to make visits and go through the process. I am very surprised that there haven't been more commits so far. Actually think the coaches are doing a good job with this so far. Things will start moving shortly.

There is no $ making with top tier. These girls are not being told to go to camps or clinics. The coaches do not need to see them play again. Vtrctb

I see many of the coaches "top tier prospects" at the camps and clinics. I thought those were the "top tier." im not sure i understand.

Correct. Some schools are having their top tier prospects come for a camp. Even when they get their lists cut down they may want to bring them in to play against each other to figure out the final group.

I think poster is referring to NOW after 9/1 and visits.

Yes. Agree. Thank you.

My daughter has been to a clinic since 9/1 where several girls there had been formally invited by the coaching staff. Some were on their visit. Is this typical? My 2c is that if you are a player they are focused on, going to a clinic is risky in case you have an off day.

Several more commits coming in, starting to move now. SBU, Virginia Tech, Dartmouth, USC and a few others. Stanford got another one, they came out of the gate fast and hard. Expect to see a bunch more this week from this past weekend’s visits, and should open wide after next weekend.

I have not seen that happening, time for camp and clinics for 21’s was the summer. All that the top players needed to do was attend summer tournaments. The top tier prospects have the coaches showing up at their houses, are being brought in on official visits, receiving love and praise, gathering offers, and now you see them making commitments. If coaches are asking players to attend a camp or clinic, they may be interested, but they are certainly not a part of their top tier.

Some players go to camps some do not. The coaches have watched and they all know who the top prospects are. Not sure what you mean by "top tier" are you talking about the top tier for the class or the top tier for particular schools?

I have been hearing there are a lot of girls travelling 3,4,5 weekends in a row for visits this fall including missing a day of school to be on campus for a class. Parents I know are coming back from the visits saying other prospect parents at the visits are saying the same thing. It's crushing their fall sports, school work, etc. not to mention very expensive. Anyone else experiencing this or seeing it with their daughter's teammates?

I hope they revisit the June 1 initial contact date so girls can knock most of it out over the summer through camps/tourney evaluations, at a minimum when there is no school work required. A short coming would be not being on campus when class is in session but that could be addressed with a fall visit before a commitment if that is on the critical path for family/player.

Seems like it could improve the experience while still "protecting" those handful of early commits.

The issue with 6/1, no classes are in session. Do not get to meet potential teammates, classmates, no support staff such as strength coach, nutritionist, athletic trainer, academic adviser, no faculty and no feel for the vibe of the school. Cannot attend a class, any athletic events, a practice, team lift, team meeting and I could go on and on. There is no perfect solution. We narrowed the list to 7, seeing all of them as quickly as possible, including 4 day trips when the schools were close together. Not ideal either, still trying to finish it all up and make a decision.

Experiencing ourselves and peers visits being made but even highest level recruits offers not being made “finish your visits” schools in no rush/taking time. Lots of stressed out girls.

I agree, no perfect solution. My daughter is a 2020 who committed before the rule change. It was challenging fitting in visits and prospect days, it was expensive, and this was as a freshman adjusting to high school. She narrowed her focus to four schools she thought were best fits overall - academics, anticipated cost, school size, campus life in addition to lacrosse program. There were some top academic/lacrosse schools she chose not to visit because, while those visits would have impressed others and are amazing options for some players, she (we) felt it was not the best fit in her case given intended major, cost, campus size and vibe. She's still really happy with her decision and so are we.

At the end of the day, no matter what the rules are, the recruiting process is time consuming. Try to enjoy it, know that you may not be able to visit every single interested school, and that's ok if you do your research and figure out overall best fit. My daughter knows players who wanted to play in college but were not recruited by many programs, or not recruited by programs where they wanted to go to school; so try to enjoy and appreciate the "problem" of so many opportunities even if it makes life really busy for a while and involves tough choices.

I see the difficulty in the Sept 1 of junior year rule change, but I also think there are downsides to June 1. Both are better than the recruiting of 8th graders. We can all thank the club coaches who promoted middle schoolers, the parents who were willing to be part of that process in middle school, and the college coaches who were willing to host and make offers to middle schoolers, for the recruiting rules intervention. Freshman year was too early, but once the craziness moved into middle school enough was enough.

Yep. And with some schools saying "finish your visits", you don't know how many or which schools to keep in play. Until your daughter gets an offer she likes, you feel the need to "stay alive" with more places.

Sounds like the coaches can't win. If they encourage players to take their time, people complain. If they want quick decisions, people complain. Coaches are not in a position to have a bunch of open ended offers hanging out there. If your daughter has told a coach his/her program is a top choice for her and communicates she is ready for an offer, and the coach is delaying making an offer, chances are the coach is waiting to see how things play out with girls higher on the list. Coaches should be honest about that if directly asked, but I wouldn't be surprised if some try to play it as simply avoiding rushing the process.

Stanford (new coach - Danielle Spencer) has 3 2021 commits already. 2 from YJs, 1 from Darien.

Do you think the top 25 programs have contacted every player they plan to contact?

Stanford also has a great 2020 class coming in next year. Will be a top 5 class with the inside lacrosse #4, #6, #20 and #34. If they can finish the 2021’s strong, will be a team to watch.

One of the YJ 21 commits is lightning fast

No offer to highest level recruits? Not so sure about that. If a coach is holding off on an offer at this point, player is certainly not on the top of their list.

This process tells the players and the parents where the player stands. Coaches do not wait around, If the coach wants the player they offer a spot. If they are talking to your daughter and having her on a visit but not offering it is most likely because the coach has other prospects ranked higher and is waiting to see if they will commit.

Do not get discouraged at this point, things change very fast especially at the teams say 30 and below. The top programs are fighting for many of the same players every time a top tier player commits several doors open. If a player has offers from Virginia, Northwestern, Boston College, Penn, Princeton and USC she can only choose 1... That means 5 spots just opened up with those teams not to mention the number of spots at schools that wanted that player but she was not considering. Even Maryland and North Carolina do not get every player they want and every time they do not get the player they want they have to move down the list. I have been through this process several times. Take a dee breath and relax.

I will say, make sure that the entire coaching staff at the schools that your daughter would say yes to knows that she will say yes.

Depends on the school and the player. Several top kids have committed already, they obviously got offers. Some schools with make offers and others wait to ensure you are down to your last one or not two schools and then offer. Some wait until they have seen all of their top players before any offers (Duke).

Even Maryland and UNC don’t get every player they want is an understatement! There are many of the very top players who want nothing to do with either program. If your daughter’s entire purpose for life boils down to 4 years and the only thing that matters to your kid is a potential national championship, then these are great choices, that aside, not so much.

Coaches do not wait with the players that they really want. If your daughter is at or near the top of a coaches list the coach will make sure that the player and the parents know that there is a spot for the player. The details of the offer can be negotiated later but the coach will tell you and your daughter they have a spot for her. If they are not offering a spot they are waiting to see if they can get other players.

Without the details of an offer, a spot is useless. I understand some coaches want you to only want their school before they offer, but the handshake has to extend both ways. You cannot expect a kid and their family to turn down great schools offering substantial money for an unknown commitment at a future date.

Thanks for the thoughtful insight. You sound a bit bitter. Why the detest?

You are missing the point. The coach will let you know if they want you. If the player expresses that they are ready to make a decision the coach will discuss / negotiate what they are willing to do.
If the coach is not saying that they have a spot for the player that is most likely because the coach is still trying to get other players (players the coach has ranked higher).

Sounds good

As a 2022 parent I'm watching the recruitment 2021's play out from the sideline but please keep posting, all this information is useful, even if its just anecdotal.

The coach will let you know they want you by making an offer. If they do not make an offer they may still be interested, but will wait until their top tier players commit elsewhere, then you will be next in line for an offer. You can spin it otherwise if that makes you feel better.

Don't worry the process will change. Every coach I have spoken to said they don't like this process as it as is. But how do you make it better, they want August off and the kids to see the schools in action (Classes and players etc.). If they start talking in June may help but the uncertainty of the winks and nods will make everyone crazy in other ways.

There is no perfect way, just see the schools, talk to everyone and figure out what works for your child. As I have read elsewhere, it is humbling for the children and parents. It's also not personal, incase you didn't already know one player is the best and everyone else goes next. It's not the end of the world.

Really try to enjoy the process

A 4th 2021 commit for Stanford (just posted it on Stanford WLax instagram). 2 YJs, 1 frrom Darien, 1 from Lax Maniax/Lake Highland. Two listed on ILWomen Young Guns Junior list (top 40). New coach (Danielle Spencer) off to a really good start with this class. Plus some very good 2020s, 4 ranked in Young Gun Senior Top 40 list.

Stanford just landed another top 2021 recruit, that is 4 now.. this one is an UA South team and IL top 40 class of 2021...

I can see why many girls want to go to Stanford - nice weather, location, successful coach, great academics. They may be the first school to fill up their 2021 roster.

Penn State and Virginia at 4 each as well

Actually, the one I was referring to is also a UA South team and IL Top 40

Navy has 10 commits

And Virginia has 5

Where is the list of all commits? The one on this site shows Navy with 2 commits.

I have nothing but the utmost respect for those that serve. They do get a 60 day head start though...

There is no public lists that show majority of commits. Here is a breakdown;
Navy-10
Virgnia-5
Penn State, Stanford-4
Jacksonville, Louisville, Maryland, Ohio State, Princeton, Rutgers, Syracuse- 3 each
Brown, Dartmouth, Elon, Harvard, Kennesaw State, Liberty, Michigan, Richmond, Stonybrook, Virginia Tech, William and Mary- 2 each
BC, BU, Colgate, Cornell, Delaware, Denver, Drexel, San Diego State, UConn, UPenn, USC, Vanderbilt, Yale- 1 each

Maryland has 4. 2 before rule changed and 2 since 9/1

Lot of those numbers aren't right. Vandy has 3. Denver has 3. BC has 2. Va Tech has 3. There are plenty others.

The academies also have a huge percentage of decommits as well. Sometimes grades and standards can’t be met, sometimes the gravity of the enormous commitment sinks in. Not all will make it to indoctrination.

Where is this list being compiled from?

No official list, this site has a commitment tab, inside lacrosse but you have to dig a bit to get a broader list through and of course social media.

So Duke has a couple commits, how did they commit with no offer?

There are, for lack of a better term two "offers" . The first "offer" is just the coach telling your daughter and you that they have a "spot" for here if she wants it. The coach is saying that if the player would like to attend XYZ University and be a part of the women's lacrosse program the coach would welcome the player. The second "offer" is the financial "offer" or scholarship "offer".

Some coaches do not like to tell you what the financial offer is until they know that the player considers the school one of their top 2 or 3 schools. Some coaches put a clock on the offer some do not. This is much more prevalent with the top recruits at the top programs.

33 days into the process...

The top programs offer the top recruits on sept 1st over the phone. Yes, a black and white financial offer, not just a “spot”. Then sweeten the offer in person on a home visit or on a official visit on campus if needed. If you are a player these coaches want, they do not play games, they can’t wait to spew out an offer and get their hand in the game. Anything else, you are being strung along. Your two offer scenario above may happen, it is because they are gunning for the top prospect while at the same time, trying to keep you interested in case the top prospect does not work out. Make up a comfortable story of how it all works, but you are wrong.

That is because there has already been back channel communication and the coach has already made it known that they want the player and the player has let the coach know that she is considering the school.

impressed with the YJ team. By my math, they have 11 commits off of the 21 blue team and all to great schools/programs. I don't think any of the other top teams are even close.

Great players and a dedicated club recruiting machine = excellent results.

That is impressive, this team must have gone undefeated for many years.

Most impressive is the list of schools these players are going to! Lori Loughlin and Felicity Huffman should of had their kids play for yellowjackets, lol.

Stanford with another commit today this time from M&D Black 21.

Still missing the mark on this club lacrosse thing. Wins, losses and the score of games is irrelevant, always has been. Compare the following two statements, tell me which one the YJ player cares about... Hey congrats on your acceptance to Harvard, or, hey remember three summers ago when my club team beat yours by 2 goals. That should probably clear it up for you.

Looks like they just got a third YJ 2021.

Not only did they land three, but three among the very top players on the team. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out with many girls opting to head west the last few years. It used to be a top girl here and there, recently much more common. The PAC12 will get more and more competitive moving forward.

Exactly... and soon some mommies and daddies will see if little suzy was over rated. That goes for all by the way.

I really don't think that ANY of the parents whose daughters land at a top school will ever give a second thought to if there daughter was over or under rated. Gee, she was over rated, but here we are at Stanford, pass me another glass of champagne please.

While I would agree that the recruiting process does put things in perspective in terms of where a player actually stands. Do you really need to be such a hammerhead?

Think they were replying to the “missing the mark” comment, not the Stanford commit. But maybe not???

I took as they were insinuating that some parents who think their daughter is a high end player were going to get a wake up call when their daughter does not get any offers from the top programs.

That's why the quote function is helpful. Not that difficult.

Seems like Cali is the place to go, If you are a standout player you’ll be able to make actual money from endorsements in a few years!

West Coast = Best Coast?

True, but tell that to the superstar that rides the bench for 4 years...just tell her, honey, your getting a great education...parents see it, kids take a litttle longer...i agree still the right call though. But tough on kids who were the go to kids their whole lives, some can handle it, some cant.

Define superstar.

The reality is: In women's lacrosse the majority of the top tier HS players do not ride the bench for four years. This myth about "HS superstars" riding the bench is promulgated repeatedly on this site and it simply is not true. Apparently many parents believe that their daughter is a "superstar" and when the offers from top tier programs don't come they try to knock the players that do get the offers from the best programs.

With a 2021 of my own, I noticed over the years that this thread was always pretty quiet. Now that it has become more active, it's nice to see that it's generally positive, with helpful advice being shared. Hopefully it will stay that way through the final year.

+1

At UMD there will be 10 All American Superstars that never see the field. That is a fact because on the roster are 44 legit high school super stars and everybody's all American. Those girls on the bench I'm sure would thrive at most other top 25 schools but they chose to compete at the very highest talent pool. only 10 girls on the field at a time...

It was the same on the 2020 thread. Once the girls start to commit and the parents realize where their daughter stands based on what the college coaches think everyone comes down to reality and remains quiet.

Well, that's just crazy talk. Are you new here?

Could not be more wrong. And this not meant to be that negative post but if you have been following 2020s it goes down as the worst group of online mud slingers ever. Goes back to when that group was in 3rd grade and the TopGuns black team reigned supreme and it was an all out brawl with Yellowjacket supporters . It was way worse and uglier than the 2023 group, if that is possible? Of course BOTC was under different ownership back then and there was no moderater. They do a very good job to try to keep it clean. Think about No moderator for a minute? I have been reading posts since day one of this website, goes back to 2012agegroup I think. Since right before Top Guns was created and have had multiple kids relevant to almost all age groups up or down a year or two, so have followed many of the age groups through the years. Anyone who has been around since the beginning of the 2020 group will certainly agree, while a very deep group in talent (that’s my positive comment on this) , a train wreck in every other aspect. But you are correct about 2021, for the most part it has been well behaved group, 2022 as well. I am sure that will continue. Good luck to all recruits in this age group!

At this point, if my daughter has not heard from a program, should she take that to mean that she will never hear from them?

Beg to differ... went back and took a look. Seems it died down right after the crazy parents got early committments for daughters, before the rule change. Wonder if any are regtetting those early committments now.

Nope dead on

Well it depends. Has she been emailing coaches, working out in the off season, going to camps, and keeping her grades up? Top 10 teams are mostly done I would imagine. Other programs haven’t even started with 21’s as they aren’t even done with 20’s (very few D1’s, more D2/many D3’s). Be patient, remain positive, and try to enjoy the process. Visit campuses and have your daughter reach out to coaches prior to coming.

Not exactly fact.

Currently Maryland has 39 on the roster which is above their norm.

Lets take a look at the freshmen classes form 2016 and 2017 and see how they have done.

Below is Freshmen Class of 2016. 9 Freshmen (7 were Under Armor All-American, 2 were not)


---------------------Freshmen 2016-----------------
-----------Under Armor All-Americans and how they did at Maryland----------

Megan Taylor..............DIAll-American - Tewaaraton Award - National Player of the Year.
Julia Braig...................DI All-American - National Defender of the Year.
Caroline Steele...........DI All-American
Shelby Mercer.............DI All-American
Jen Giles.....................DI All-American
Megan Doherty:..........Starts Every Game
Kelsey Cummings.......Reserve Player

--------------Non-Under Armour AA's and how they did--------

Marissa Donoghue..........Plays in just about Every Game So, Jr, Sr years.
Katherine Golladay..........Reserve Player



Below is Freshmen class of 2017. 9 Freshmen (6 were Under Armour All-Americans , 3 were not)


----------------------Freshmen 2017-----------------------
-----------Under Armor All-Americans - Current Seniors and how they have done so far-------

Kali Hartshorn..................DI All-American.
Lizzi Colson......................DI All-American.
Brindi Griffin.....................NCAA All-Tournament Team - started and or played every game for 4 years.
Hannah Warther................Played in every game in 2019 - missed 2018 injury.
Natalie Miller.....................Has been a reserve player.
Niki Sliwak........................Has been a reserve player.

--------------Non-Under Armor AA's-----------------

Julia Salandra.....................Has been a reserve player.
Andrea Mctaggart...............Has been a reserve player.
Victoria L'insalata................Has been a reserve player.

Total 18 Recruits over two years. 13 were Under Armour All-Americans (or as you say superstars).

Out of the 13 superstars:

7 Became Division I All-Americans (including a Tewaaraton, Player of the Year and The National Defender of the Year).
4 Played in just about every game (including one who made the NCAA All-Tournament team and another who made the IL All-Rookie team).
3 reserve players.

Out of the 5 non-superstars:

1 became a regular player.
4 reserve players.

By the way.... Every single one of those players is either still playing or graduated last year after four years of playing No, 50% did not quit.
By the way.... Most of the "superstars" did not ride the bench or disappear in college.

By the way.... Yes, I am retired.

Wow! Somebody has a lot of free time looking up meaningless information! It's woman lacrosse, nobody cares, except mommy and daddy!

That's not really true about the top 10 school. UNC only has 2 commits. Florida only has 3. Northwestern only has 1. While MD, Stanford and UVA have quite a few there are still a lot of spots out there. The last girl that I would say was in most everyone's top tier committed to Stanford tonight. Now that the top tier is pretty much done the schools are regrouping to bring in the next tier.

However, most of these coaches would probably have let you know if you are in their second tier. If your're emailing and calling and they aren't calling you back it's probably a bad sign.

couldn't agree more on the 2020's. What a toxic age group. And many with the biggest mouths are playing are the very bottom college programs and many with zero money. That's why everyone quiets down when they finally realize that Maryland isn't in their daughters future but rather Delaware State

Obviously you care. If you don't care, then why are you on this site making comments? Are you not a mother or a father of a player? If you are not then you should really get some help. To your point though, I do have a lot of free time. If you are pressed for time or have to go answer to somebody then may I suggest that you stop wasting it perusing this site and its meaningless information.

Why do you attack the poster who presents facts that differ from the narrative that so many want to advance on this site.

Why not attack the post that spewed out the BS?

Since you have plenty of time, can you give us the top 50 incoming fr lists for those 2 years, and while your at it, the 2 previous years for upperclassman...36 on a team, 12 play. Thanks in advance

That is hilarious. You got caught with your pants down spewing B.S. with no facts behind it. This person calls you out by doing the work and giving you a fact-based response and now that you look like a fool you give a laughable response. Crawl back under a rock with your tail between your legs and kudos to this person for taking the time to research this.

That's a BadPerson response, Thank you to the person who put this together.. its interesting to see how things shake out especially at the top program..

[/quote]

That's not really true about the top 10 school. UNC only has 2 commits. Florida only has 3. Northwestern only has 1. While MD, Stanford and UVA have quite a few there are still a lot of spots out there. The last girl that I would say was in most everyone's top tier committed to Stanford tonight. Now that the top tier is pretty much done the schools are regrouping to bring in the next tier.

[/quote]

The top schools have still not completed their 2021 class, and we are at about 6 weeks in since September 1, I am honestly a little surprised by the pace of this as I think i expected to hear more about the midnight phone call or knocks on the door.
From the outside ( i have a 2022) it looks like there will be plenty of time to make visits, watch fall ball, have several conversations, meet the team etc etc. before any handshakes take place..

Also a parent of a 2022. Is there a particularly good source for these commitments? We see some but curious which schools are moving faster than others.

Inside lacrosse Top 50 Incoming freshmen fall 2017:

11 were named Division I All - Americans
7 were named All-Conference
15 start and or play in just about every game.
12 have been reserve players through their sophomore year.
4 sustained injury
1 redshirted as freshman I do not believe is on 2020 roster.

Maryland had the most with 5 players.
UNC
ND
Princeton
Hopkins
Syracuse
UVA
Stanford
USC
Duke
Florida
PSU
Northwestern
Loyola
BC
All had multiple players.

through sophomore year (of the 45 players who are playing no injuries) looks like this group is doing pretty well. They are playing at the most competitive programs and competing.

Agreed - thank you for taking the time to do the research and make a point using FACTS. I wish I was retired too ...

Not the original poster, but nothing for nothing, poster gave us two years of facts for best team in the country...pretty small sample size, no? It also fits their narrative. Most, if not all of those kids were high top 50 incoming freshman, top 50 would be considered stars.

So, looks like 33 of the 45 (how have not been hindered by injury) are playing in just about every game at the top programs and many are receiving honors, AA, AC.

If there is going to be a second surge of interest, as the top 25 programs realize that they will not get all of the top girls they wanted, it can't happen soon enough in my opinion. All summer I was thinking that this process would be over before the November tournaments. There are girls holding offers and anxiously hoping that their top schools, or schools higher on their lists, will contact them. At some point, their hands will be forced. At the same time, there are very strong schools (at least academically) that appear to be getting off to a very, very slow start with the process. My 2c is that this leads to a lot of decommitting and poaching down the road. The Stanfords of the world have done a very good job of locking up talent quickly.

Stanford up to 8 in the Class of 2021

Inside lacrosse Top 50 (IL only listed 49... there was no #39) Incoming Freshmen fall 2018:

quick look

2 were All-Americans (the only two freshmen to earn AA Honors).
aprox 24 started and or played in every game.
aprox 17 were reserve players.
4 - 6 injuries.

I did not check but I'm sure there were some All-Conference, All-Rookie etc...

Maryland and Syracuse had the most players with 5.

UNC
Florida
Duke
BC
Princeton
Notre Dame
Loyola
UVA
USC
All had multiple players.

Incoherent babble.

Northwestern also had 4 players on the lis.

Looks like the Top Programs get the majority of highly touted HS players. Many of those players see action (play in every contest/start) as freshmen and many of the reserves work their way into being starters/major contributors in subsequent years. Many become All-Americans, All-Conference, All-Region and few never develop to the point of getting regular playing time in every game.
It also appears that the vast majority do not stop playing.

Look at Maryland results from last year and get back to us Mr/Mrs Facts.

Hopefully this helpful... My experience and how it was explained to us by coaches during this process was that they grouped players in three tiers of 10-15 each. As first tier players committed, they moved second to first and third to second. If you have not been told where you stand and/or have not had semi-regular and/or no contact, you are in group 3 or not on their list. You can certainly wait and see what happens, but I would widen my net asap. If you have offers from schools on your list, make sure you are clear on their expectations on when they want an answer. Some will wait, but not forever. From the commitments I have seen on this site, inside lacrosse and what my daughter feeds me from social media, a large percentage of the top 40 on the Inside Lacrosse list are committed as well as a couple of dozen really good players not on the list (the list is just that, not the final say on a kid's talent). Teams are generally deep into their tier 1 and working tier 2 players at this juncture. If you still are not active with those top schools, again, widen your net.

How do you widen the net now? Do you tell a coach you are suddenly interested? This is a serious question.

Thank you. We will continue to hold out hope.

follow Yellow Jackets, M&D , Skywalkers, Steps etc on twitter.. they all post their commits..
and of course BOC & Inside Lacrosse..

Yes, I think you need to let them know you're interested.. reach out to all the coaches.. head coach, assistant coaches and tell them you want to attend school and play lax there.

- It is difficult to ascertain exactly what your point is but we must assume that you are implying that many "HS Under Armour All-Americans" will "never" see the field in college. Your statement is not accurate or true.

- You then use the word "fact" and state that "on the roster are 44 legit high school super stars and everybody's All-American". Your statement is not accurate or true.

- "Those girls on the bench I'm sure would thrive at most other top 25 schools but they chose to compete at the very highest talent pool." Since your basic premiss is not true even this statement suspect.

- "highest talent pool" I would agree with that.

- "10 girls on the field at a time." Your statement is not accurate or true. Unless I missed a rule change I am pretty sure 12 girls compete at a time.

I will assume that when you say "All American superstar" you a referring to HS Under Armour All-Americans since there are only 44 players selected per year. I would not consider players receiving other HS accolades and honors as "superstars" due to the fact that thousands of players are named all county/league/division/district etc... and four or five hundred are named US Lacrosse AA. Last year Maryland had 38 players on their roster 22 were Under Armor All-Americans.

I assume that you want us to believe that many Under Armour All Americans will "never" see the field in college. That simply is not true. Although many freshmen may not see much playing time the majority of the UAAA's do in fact work their way into the lineup.

Take a look at last years roster:

There were 10 seniors (2 were transfers) in addition there was 1 redshirt junior who obviously started her career with the seniors. All 9 of the freshmen class fall 2015 were on the roster in 2019 none stopped playing.

7 of the 9 original were Under Armour All-Americans. The two transfers were not Under Armour All-Americans.

* Mercer: .......was UA. saw limited playing time as freshman and sophomore then started every game junior and senior year. All-Big 10
* Golladay: ....reserve player.
* Giles: ..........was UA. played every game all 4 years multiple honors including 2X 1st team All-American.
* Douerty: ......was UA. Redshirt as freshman. Started past three years. One year left. All-Big 10 rookie team in 17'.
* Donoghue:...Saw limited time as a freshmen. Played in every game the past 3 years.
* Steel: ...........was UA. 4 year starter. Multiple honors including 2X All-American.
* Cummings: ..was UA. reserve player.
* Braig: ...........was UA. 4 year starter. multiple honors including 2X 1st team All-American and National Defender of the Year.
* Taylor: ..........was UA. 4 year starter. multiple honors including 3X All-American, Goaltender of the year, Player of the Year, Tewaaraton Award Winner etc...

6 of the 7 HS "superstars" became superstars in college.

The two transfers:

* Siverson: ...All-American
* Evans: .......All-American

As incoming freshmen that group might have been the strongest in Maryland history with 7 Under Armor All-Americans. Last years freshmen class had 4 Under Armor All-Americans. While it is true that not all HS "superstars" will see much playing time as freshmen it is misleading to state that many will "never" see the field. The large majority probably 85% or more of the "superstars" go on to have very successful college careers at the most competitive programs in the country.

Last year at Maryland was not the norm. They had an already incredible senior class and then they added 2 All-American Transfers so trying to crack the lineup as a freshmen was most likely more difficult than most years.

One point I will give is that it is much more difficult to get meaningful playing time as a freshmen at the top 10 programs.

I believe another myth that has been debunked is the myth that 50% of the players will quit.

I see nothing wrong with that. The coaches are doing the exact same thing. Players they told were second or third tier are going to get more attention, e-mails, phone calls and offers to come on an un-official/official visit. I would go back over your list and engage/re-engage to see where there is interest. I would re-assess all the contact received so far and engage. It is a numbers game, the more schools you contact, the more options you will have. It will also give you a more clear picture where you stand with each school. Knowing that is half the battle. It is also a time to reflect on what is most important with your daughter. The assessment criteria for selecting a school should include more than Lacrosse. If she absolutely wants to play no matter the school, there is a place for her somewhere. If school size, location, ranking and other criteria are very important, that will help focus your search. Most important is to stay positive, it will help your daughter be the same. Good luck, I hope she finds a great fit.

Excellent, encouraging and spot on... Thank you.

My point is that at a school like Maryland EVERY girl is extremely good and 90% came in highly decorated. Thanks for nitpicking. For arguments sake, 16 girls play regularly, maybe. My point is I'm taking nothing away from the talent level at the back end of a roster like UMD. They are all studs, only so many can be on the field. I was NOT saying that they fizzle out or were over rated in HS. Its a numbers game and schools like UMD, UNC etc are the best of the best and they collect talent. Thanks for your dissertation

As for your rebuke below; I stand by all my statements. Is there a single girl on the UMD roster that did not receive "All something" in HS?? I'd be surprised, but perhaps there is an outlier I missed.

"- It is difficult to ascertain exactly what your point is but we must assume that you are implying that many "HS Under Armour All-Americans" will "never" see the field in college. Your statement is not accurate or true. ---IT IS HIGHLY POSSIBLE

- You then use the word "fact" and state that "on the roster are 44 legit high school super stars and everybody's All-American". Your statement is not accurate or true.--IT IS TRUE

- "Those girls on the bench I'm sure would thrive at most other top 25 schools but they chose to compete at the very highest talent pool." Since your basic premiss is not true even this statement suspect. " --THEY WOULD

Thank you for clearing it up. Many people do however spew nonsense and make very inaccurate self serving statements all in an effort to tear players down or diminish accomplishments. I do not like it when adults try to elevate their daughter by trying to tear down or diminish others players. Most of the time it all sour grapes. My apologies to you.

I should add that when you send e-mails, send video and/or link to a recruiting page you created. It costs money, but consider getting to any fall and winter camps they offer. Send them your fall schedule when you have it.

Thank you for your apology. A meaningful dialogue between two people is rare on this board. My opening thesis should have been clearer. Thank you for providing me the opportunity to state it more clearly. Have a nice day, Lax fan from LI.

I also have questioned many coaches as to how they were going about their recruiting. Everyone seemed to have very different opinions and approaches. I am sure there is much to be learned this year as far as a what to do, and what not to do, in this new era of recruiting. This goes both for players and for coaches to apply to next year. But it seems every coach has different buying power depending on the lacrosse program history, coaches reputation, academic standing, facilities etc... and therefore must adjust their plan accordingly. Every player also has their own buying power depending on their playing ability, speed, field position, grades, financial backing, personality etc... and therefore must adjust their plan accordingly. Then once the coach and player feel they have a good match, the financial dance begins. The very top recruits make out extremely well, but coaches do like to spread the wealth out so every tier should get to benefit somewhat.

What does one consider “making out very well” vs “benefit somewhat”. Serious question

A few additional stream of consciousness comments / observations / opinions:
- by my count, approx 150 girls have committed so far, 100+ "top" girls, and 40-50 that clearly knew early where they wanted to go
- the other place to follow commits, not previously mentioned above is sportsrecruits.com/committed (have to sort through all sports)
- i've noticed not all clubs post on website / twitter, for ex. - Capital and Skywalkers seem hard to track?
- my daughter committed earlier this week, and it was a bit of a roller coaster! 35 - 40 schools contacted her on 9/1. Of the top 15 (her list) that we expected going in, 12 reached out, 3 disappeared surprisingly, 3 top schools reached out out of the blue, and then 25 or so reached out that were further down her list. based on this she was pretty honest with the coaches about where they were on her list, and most were pretty good about same. Only 2 schools played out much differently than we expected.
- if a school has you in one of their top groups, they don't need to see you play again, and if you've been there previously, you don't really need to go again either
- regarding expanding your net - I would have the club coach reach out to the schools, perhaps they previously thought / were led to believe your daughter was focused on higher end lacrosse / higher academic, whatever. it won't matter, if they are interested, they won't worry about the why.
- I believe there are still at least 40 - 50 girls with high end offers in hand deciding this week and next, so this seems like the top 30 schools will be actively filling their spots up until the Nov tournaments
- really interesting to see the handful of top programs / names that are either going really slow or not getting any of their top targets ... (names withheld to protect the innocent

PS - I thought the MD data was interesting!

I have seen a few general approaches as to offers. Some top schools offer a lower amount and they have a merit system where you can earn more with your play. I have seen schools offer escalating amounts where it increases over the four years. That is often used if the scholly money is tight for that class and/or the school is landing more top recruits than expected. This takes money from future classes. Setting expectations for any particular player and school is a shot in the dark. Top players will see 25-75% with a very rare number above that but it does happen For others it could be an admissions slot with no money up to 25%.

Huge congrats to your daughter! Sounds like the top 30 schools won't have any room left for girls on the 2nd tier and below?

Making out very well is getting an offer for full tuition or full ride offers. And yes they absolutely exist, despite the many who say they don’t . And benefit somewhat is the other end of the spectrum, I have heard of players taking spots with zero scholarship money, but feel that is uncommon. I do know many players in years past, filling some of the last roster spots in the 10-20% range as incoming freshman with room to improve based on performance , that would be benefiting somewhat.

You make the assumption the club coach will help. What if they don't? And far as camps/clinics - If the top 30 are filled so don't waste your time money there at this point?

Through my family's experience (realize others may have different experiences):

First of, a fully funded program has 12.6 scholarships available (not all programs are fully funded and Ivy's obviously work differently) that need to be spread across a full team/multiple grades. With that as perspective:


Top offers/top tier recruits: 50-75% of all expenses (tuition, books, room and board, etc.). 75% unusual b/c of spreading 12.6 full scholarships but not unheard of. Usually 1-2 kids per class in this bracket

Solid recruits/expect to contribute: 25-50%. Have seen this tier most typically offered 25-35%.

0-25%: Some money kid has potential but lower on the totem pole.

No money: like the kid, has some upside, willing to help them through admissions, but not offering them money. May have also been a late commit where money was already spoken for.

This is generally the framework the head of our club communicated to me as well. I realize others may have a different experience.

Correction to what I wrote above. A fully funded women's lacrosse program has 12 scholarships (NCAA limit) not 12.6 which is what the men have. So 12 scholarships to spread across a roster of typically 30-35 (some teams have larger rosters, some smaller). And not every kid gets a scholarship obviously.

Here is an example of how the 12 athletic grants in aid (scholarships) at a fully funded program could possibly be allocated:

Every school and situation is different but If the 12 are spit over four years each coach has 3 scholarships to offer the incoming class. (that is simplified and not always the case)

- Top tier players i.e. top 30 caliber players, the type of player that is getting multiple offers from Top 10 programs.
50% and above.

- All other players could get anything or nothing.

Here is an example: (But remember the coach can split it any way they want.) and this does not include merit based academic scholarship or need based aid.

Top Recruit = 75%

player 2 = 50%

player 3 = 50%

player 4 = 25%

Player 5 = 25%

player 6 = 25%

player 7 = 25%

player 8 = 25%

Player 9 = 0

Player 10 = 0

The coaches have at their disposal the dollar equivalent of "the total cost to attend the university" that includes Tuition, Room, Board, Books etc... multiplied by the number of scholarships the "institution" allows the program to have. "Fully Funded" programs are allowed 12 "athletic" scholarships. Not all programs are fully funded.

Lets assume the the total cost to attend is $50,000

12 x 50,000 = $600,000 that the coach can divide up at their disposal. There is no standard each coach can do as they see fit.

Merit based "academic scholarships" can be combined with "athletic scholarships".

Need based "aid" can not be combined with "Athletic scholarships".

Ivys do not offer "Athletic Scholarships". Either you pay full freight or you receive "need based financial aid" Go to the schools website and plug your numbers into the Aid Calculator they are pretty accurate.

Northwestern, Notre Dame, Boston College, Duke, Georgetown etc... Also have aggressive need based aid. In fact I have known people who gave up their athletic scholarship because they qualified for need based aid and the need based aid was greater than the athletic scholarship.

Maryland, North Carolina, Virginia, Michigan, Penn State, Stony Brook etc... Are Public Universities and in general offer less in terms of merit based aid or need based aid.

Many, Many factor go into the equation. Grades, test scores, athletic ability, need etc...

See below re: Combining Athletic and Academic aid.

NCAA requirements to combine academic and athletic scholarships

Does the NCAA let you combine academic and athletic scholarships? Yes, but you have to earn it in the classroom. While Division I athletic scholarships are relatively easy to qualify for — you need to graduate high school, complete 16 core courses and earn a GPA of 2.3 —the criteria are significantly higher for student-athletes looking to secure non-athletic financial aid. To accept an academic scholarship as an incoming freshman, student-athletes need to meet the following criteria:

Division I:

Top 10 percent of high school graduating class
3.5 cumulative GPA out of 4.0
1200 SAT score/105 ACT sum score
Division II:

Top 20 percent of high school graduating class
3.5 cumulative GPA out of 4.0
1140 SAT score/100 ACT sum score
By imposing these requirements, the NCAA is preventing schools from using academic scholarships as a loophole to get athletes to compete at their school These requirements ensure athletes who combine athletic and academic aid truly deserve it. For this reason, athletes with impressive academics are especially valuable to coaches. If a coach is evaluating you and a comparable athlete to fill a positional need, good grades and test scores can give you an edge. The coach will make an offer to the recruit with better academics almost every time.

Good luck to all.

Athletes with very high test scores and grades can receive a lot of Academic $$ if they drop down a bet in terms of Academic School: Duke or Hopkins may not give you academic money but many other schools will.
High caliber athletes (the ones being offered $$ at Maryland, UNC, Northwestern, BC etc) can drop down a bit and receive significant $$.

My grade schooler is interested in playing travel lacrosse in the Farmingdale area. We’ve never played before but she’s always been a top athlete in soccer and basketball. I heard the LI Yellow Jackets are the best club, but also that the owner Carol Rose is racist and perhaps even transgender too. Appears very possible based on internet pics of her (sorry but she looks like a dude) and the club (everyone looks alike). Also found Rose’s Twitter profile and saw that deplorably she’s an active supporter of the orange traitor in the White House. Not a character role model I want for my adopted immigrant daughter, but then it’s also clear that the Yellow Jackets are tremendously successful. I don’t think it’s right to fault the character of the entire club or the many other coaches without at least asking for honest feedback first. What’s been everyone’s experience?

No one respond to this, obviously just trying to incite or be funny.

How do the moderators let the same guy post the same message on 5 different threads?

you guys wanna clean this up..

( I can copy and paste too)

YJ's are the best although the double dipping by the owner by running all the tournaments the girls play in has always been shadey

You still pay to go to tournaments even if you clubs director had no stake in it, so what’s the difference. The only difference you should be concerned with is the college commitment list, compared to other clubs. Especially this year, staggering.

Look at the lists for the last 15 years...staggering every year.

But....how many Teewaraton winners did they produce with all those elite #1 players? Zero, that’s right , not one could step up to the top spot! Lots of but kissing going on at YJ, I’d rather keep it real on a club that actually cares about the girls. No matter how many YJ groupies come around to recruit my daughter, the answer will still be no, we don’t play for pretenders, and my daughters commitment is just as “staggering” as some pesky insect that nobody has any use for

SS was a YJ!

The reality is there are plenty of kids getting need based grants from a lot of schools, but they don't care to talk about it and like to lump it all in as "scholarship money". At the end of the day who really cares what it's called if you're getting scholarships/grants to a school that you wanted to attend its all good

You need a tissue?

Was windering. Why the sudden interest in who goes to Stanford. Maybe you want to gloat? You are obviously a 20 or 21 parent who lives through little suzy. Remember to keep the grades up when the playing time is down.

I feel sorry for you, I really do. Anyway, Shannon Smith was a YJ...

Maryland dad. Although I detest to admit it, all those YJ kids going to Stanford can play. I don't predict a lot of "when playing time is down" for them. Or the NJ or MD kid either.

Haha. My kid is at Stanford with a great new coach in great weather with great academics and your is not. Whether she plays or not, incredible envirnoment to go to school. You jealous hater.

Agree. Who cares what it's called. I have said it before on this site... be thankful your daughter is fortunate enough to play this sport.... tremendous opportunities out their for our daughters.

Keep "windering" why your kid won't get recruited there.

What are the 2021 commit numbers on Long Island per club? YJ, TG, Liberty, Legacy, Elevate.

I believe 16 of the 26 YJ Rose girls are verbally committed (apologies if I missed any):

Harvard- 2
Yale- 1
Stanford-3
Virginia-1
Boston College-1
Naval Academy-1
West Point-1
USC-1
Florida-1
Maryland-2
Penn State-1
Arizona State-1

Two YJ Bert Girls have also committed.
Stony Brook and Drexel

YJ Clearly leading the way, with some quality commits from Liberty 2 (USC and SB), and Legacy has 3 (SB, Colorado, Bucknell). Anything from TG or Elevate?

I believe 16 of the 26 YJ Rose girls are verbally committed (apologies if I missed any):

Harvard- 2
Yale- 1
Stanford-3
Virginia-1
Boston College-1
Naval Academy-1
West Point-1
USC-1
Florida-1
Maryland-2
Penn State-1
Arizona State-1




Impressive. The college coaches like and respect CR and they like girls from LI. I don't think any of the MD teams are even close to this in number or quality of schools.

I believe 16 of the 26 YJ Rose girls are verbally committed (apologies if I missed any):

Harvard- 2
Yale- 1
Stanford-3
Virginia-1
Boston College-1
Naval Academy-1
West Point-1
USC-1
Florida-1
Maryland-2
Penn State-1
Arizona State-1




Impressive. The college coaches like and respect CR and they like girls from LI. I don't think any of the MD teams are even close to this in number or quality of schools.

If this is a competition YJ is winning we always commit first. Are any of the 2nd tier YJ blue players getting interest?

All YJ early commits still held in high regard by their perspective Coaches, if anything their stock went up since 8th grade. I guess this is the start of the jealousy, wondered when it would rear its ugly head. Almost all the girls on Rose have high interest, just starting to get 2nd round call backs from the better schools and working out financials for those girls.

All YJ early commits still held in high regard by their perspective Coaches, if anything their stock went up since 8th grade. I guess this is the start of the jealousy, wondered when it would rear its ugly head. Almost all the girls on Rose have high interest, just starting to get 2nd round call backs from the better schools and working out financials for those girls. [/quote]

[/quote]
Maybe she had a bad day? lots of girls who didn’t make UA that are headed to good schools. Sounds more like you are hurting because your daughter didn’t get any good calls.. so you had to immediately come up with some Theory so you can live with yourself. Everyone will find their place. Why would you attack a 16 year on a public forum, a person Like you deserves more time in jail that someone like LL. Get a life and worry about your own. Or maybe Penn state and the others didn’t call your daughter cause
That’s saw you are an Buthead on the side lines.

[/quote]
Maybe she had a bad day? lots of girls who didn’t make UA that are headed to good schools. Sounds more like you are hurting because your daughter didn’t get any good calls.. so you had to immediately come up with some Theory so you can live with yourself. Everyone will find their place. Why would you attack a 16 year on a public forum, a person Like you deserves more time in jail that someone like LL. Get a life and worry about your own. Or maybe Penn state and the others didn’t call your daughter cause
That’s saw you are an Buthead on the side lines. [/quote]

Did I miss something? What are you talking about? Who had a bad day? What does UA have to do with anything? Where was the attack?

So.. you are saying they will start right away. The 20 class is pretty strong. I would have to believe that a few upper class girls would be playing too. Now i see what a few people on here have been saying... don't you?

What have a few people on here been saying? People say a lot on here. You should probably clarify what you are trying to say.

Just saw the US U17 roster, Saw 2 Hasselbecks on the list. I guesss ex NFL player Matt Hasselbeck kids play Lax. Saw one is class of 2020. How is she on a u17;team?

The 2020 age group is split on the date for U17. Just like many of the 2021’s are playing for the U15.

U17: The player must be born on or between September 1, 2001 and August 31, 2003.
U15: The player must be born on or between September 1, 2003 and August 31, 2005.

Typical age for "on grade" 2020s is 17, just beginning to turn 18 since the school year began.

I'm not original poster, dont want to speak for poster, but i'm thinking he's saying only 12 spots on the field, with every class loaded with studs, and people come on here saying 5 or 6 fr will start...its impossible...i agree with the post if thats what their saying.

Typical stuff, original poster was saying watch out, limited playing time (they were talking career not just as a freshman), someone responds to the post saying no, they are good players and will not have limited time during their career. Now the conversation changes to as a freshman and blah, blah, blah. The 10 Stanford commits are an impressive list based on their high school careers. Many are going to have a big impact on the program, some to a lesser extent. Good luck to all of them, they will all likely receive a degree from one of the best academic institutions in the country.

In reference to Stanford, all may not start, but all will likely see the field as long as they stay healthy. Starting/playing time on college is different than HS ball. Especially with the offenses and defenses these coaches are running. Every change of possesion, coaches are switching personnel like the men's game. So likely 18-22 girls see significant time throughout the season, rather than your 12-13 in HS ball.

But whichever school any of the girls go to, lets hope they play well and keep the Long Island known as a hotbed for lacrosse. It will keep opening doors for our younger girls down the road.

Yes, very typical. Sour grapes and jealousy... spew nonsense... and then move the goal post to fit the narrative and or mantra. Some try to tear down, belittle, diminish others in an effort to somehow elevate their own daughter.

look at reality. Look at last years Top 10 and how many freshmen started (I will consider all players who play meaningful minutes most every game as starters). In competitive games, the Top 10 Teams seam to play between 15 - 21 players constantly.

Below are the Top 10 teams from 2019 and how many freshmen saw regular playing time in competitive games.

1 - Maryland - 0
2 - Boston College - 0 - 1
3 - North Carolina - 3
4 - Northwestern - 1 - 2
5 - Syracuse - 4
6 - Princeton - 2
7 - Virginia - 2
8 - Denver - 1 - 2
9 - Notre Dame - 1 - 2
10 - Loyola - 2

Although Stanford did not finish the season in the Top 10 they are certainly a Top 20 - 30 Program (and could finish Top 10 in 2020). Stanford is on the rise.

I would bet that freshmen playing time at Stanford this year will fall in line with the schools listed above. I am guessing 2 - 3 freshmen will see regular playing time in competitive games.

Good luck to all the freshmen.

Talk about clueless, lease tell us the one program where 18-22 layers are seeing significant laying time, what a joke. Not sure about the rest of the country but on LI the 2021 class is generally thought of as being weak, I am sure they don't think so but the club coaches and the school coaches do.

Thanks for weighing in on how weak the LI girls are. You should probably email all the college coaches around the nation, they didn't seem to get your memo.

It varies from program to program and some schools play more players than others in "competitive games".

Maryland and Boston College tend to play 15 players in their competitive games.

North Carolina averages 19 players in competitive games.

Northwestern averages 21 players in competitive game.

Syracuse averages 21 - 22 players in competitive games.

Princeton averages 16 players in competitive games.

Virginia averages 16 - 17 players in competitive games.

From game to game it is mostly the same players that are getting the playing time. Teams obviously play more players when they compete against less competitive teams or if the school gets out of hand.

"if the score gets out of hand"

First off some of the college coaches have not gone after this age very hard , UNC , Cuse , ND as an example of a few . Some of the actual commitments I am sure the college coaches are excited about but I am basing my opinion on what I have seen and conversations with coaches in LI who generally feel the 2021 class is weak . It’s not to say there are not some very good players but honestly there aren’t many stand outs in this year. Are there any decent high school teams out there where the obviously best player is going to be a junior this year , I can tell you a bunch where it was a junior last year . By stand outs I mean players that have been or will be the best player on their high school team for more than 1 year , have made most if not all the “ all star “ teams with combined ages they have tried out for , have received the highest accolades of any player on their high school team .

Why just make nonsense up . Seriously this could be the biggest fake news post yet. Your stats include players who were on the field less than 1 minute . Significant playing time in big games those team average 15 -16 players . I have watched many Cuse and UNC games and can guarantee you your numbers are wrong . As far as Stanford,those LI commits for the most part should see some playing time as Stanford in terms of lax is just not a very strong program and benefit from the west coast bias . Every year IS Lacrosse ranks these west coast teams high and every year after playing weak schedules they enter the NCAA tournament and truth is revealed .I get it they want to grow the sport but maybe do regional rankings if you want to at least try to be fair. This year it’s the ACC and Maryland , next year it will be the ACC and Maryland then repeat the following year ,is what it is.

Thanks for your all knowing guaranty. If Maryland is your benchmark for what is and is not a strong program then I guess just about all programs are not strong. Stanford is in fact a strong program and would be considered by most as being stronger than about 90 other programs.

“Thanks for your all knowing guaranty. If Maryland is your benchmark for what is and is not a strong program then I guess just about all programs are not strong. Stanford is in fact a strong program and would be considered by most as being stronger than about 90 other programs.”

Stanford is a top 20-30 team and they benefit from playing in a weak conference. If those same players were going to MD, Cuse, UNC, ND , BC they would have less of a chance of seeing significant playing time . If you think my all knowing guarantee is wrong then why don’t you tell us who is going to be better than those teams over the next several years . If your benchmark for being a strong program is being better than Delaware State than I guess Stanford is up there with the best .A strong program to me is perennial top 20 with a legit shot at top 10 , Stanford is not that .

Not yet. New coach, a big cohort of great players all at once, to add to the talent they already have. If they repeat that for a few years, look out. They may make the leap.

Please sounds a lot like USC several years ago , same state , different team . You YJ parents are too funny , “great players” . Got to watch all the USC great players against SBU group of mediocre talent , how did that work out last weekend . Yes Inside Lacrosse will hype it up as the next great program and they will end up being exactly what they are top 20-30. The good news is they will have accomplished something that many others have not , a great top 5 education.

ND? Really? What have they accomplished. This really hurts your argument.

My daughter is not going to a top 10 program. Maybe a 20-30, or maybe not. If she goes to a place that hasn't accomplished anything like Stanford or ND, maybe I'll have to wear my gear from her higher ranked club team, when I was still proud of her.

Well Stanford did manage to beat Stony Brook last year, even on the backend of two game east coast trip. They also managed to make the tournament the last two years, something your beloved ACC teams like Duke, Notre Dame, Virginia Tech and Louisville could not accomplish. Time will tell, but I’ll tale Stanford top 20 2021-2025.

“Well Stanford did manage to beat Stony Brook last year, even on the backend of two game east coast trip. They also managed to make the tournament the last two years, something your beloved ACC teams like Duke, Notre Dame, Virginia Tech and Louisville could not accomplish. Time will tell, but I’ll tale Stanford top 20 2021-2025.”

You make it way too easy . They make the tournament because they play in a weak conference . The hilarious thing is your ignorance is even more astounding , who did they play first round of the NCAA tournament the last two years a .500 ACC team and another ACC team who you just belittled because they did not make the NCAA the year before . What happened each year, they lost in essentially non competitive games . This year the NCAA will feel bad for them like they did USC last year and try and give them an easy path deep into the tournament only problem will be the same thing that happens to USC , just not very good . Again it’s obviously a great academic school and the girls that go there are set to have great futures just like the girls that go to Harvard and many others just stop with the nonsense that they will ever be in the running for an NCAA title . Not going to happen.

NCAA title, what happened to being a perennial top 20 team as the benchmark? You keeping moving the bar. Stony Brook lost two games to western teams last year in Denver and Stanford. Stanford beat Albany as well, 2-0 against the American East, that incredibly difficult conference Stony Brook plays in. PAC 12 conference is better than the American East.

U Mass Lowell
Vermont
Albany
UMBC
Hartford
Binghamton
New Hampshire

Don't bother with this joker, it is a waste of time. Jealousy does strange things to people and for some reason girls / women's lacrosse really brings it out in some people.

Below is the RPI Ranking for last year. PAC 12 had 3 teams in the Top 25. We all know the ACC is the toughest conference but please stop with your nonsense, USC, Stanford and Colorado are all very good programs. Oregon and Arizona State will continue to improve and Cal... well I am not sure what goes on at that school ; - )

1 Maryland
2 Boston College
3 North Carolina
4 Northwestern
5 Princeton
6 Syracuse
7 Virginia
8 Florida
9 Denver
10 Michigan
11 Southern California
12 Loyola
13 Navy
14 Notre Dame
15 Stony Brook
16 James Madison
17 Penn St.
18 Penn
19 Colorado
20 Johns Hopkins
21 Dartmouth
22 Massachusetts
23 Richmond
24 Georgetown
25 Stanford
26 Jacksonville
27 Wagner
28 Duke
29 High Point
30 Hofstra
31 Liberty
32 Army West Point
33 Fairfield
34 Virginia Tech
35 Mount St. Mary's
36 Villanova
37 Towson
38 Ohio St.
39 Boston U.
40 Cornell
41 Vanderbilt
42 Albany (NY)
43 San Diego St.
44 Saint Joseph's
45 Louisville
46 Harvard
47 George Mason
48 Brown
49 Elon
50 UC Davis
51 California
52 Cincinnati
53 Coastal Carolina
54 Lehigh
55 Marquette
56 Siena
57 Rutgers
58 Colgate
59 William & Mary
60 Monmouth
61 Robert Morris
62 Duquesne
63 Marist
64 Manhattan
65 Bryant
66 Temple
67 Fresno St.
68 Davidson
69 Columbia
70 VCU
71 Furman
72 New Hampshire
73 Delaware
74 Campbell
75 Yale
76 Drexel
77 UConn
78 Mercer
79 UMBC
80 Vermont
81 George Washington
82 Kennesaw St.
83 American
84 Arizona St.
85 Winthrop
86 Old Dominion
87 Oregon
88 La Salle
89 Bucknell
90 Longwood
91 Detroit Mercy
92 Holy Cross
93 Canisius
94 Central Mich.
95 East Carolina
96 Quinnipiac
97 Niagara
98 LIU Brooklyn (now LIU)
99 Lafayette
100 Saint Francis
101 Sacred Heart
102 Radford
103 UMass Lowell
104 Stetson
105 Butler
106 Gardner-Webb
107 Binghamton
108 Iona
109 Kent St.
110 St. Bonaventure
111 Central Conn. St.
112 Presbyterian
113 Wofford
114 Hartford
115 Howard
116 Delaware St.

You have gone from a big cohort of "great" players and taking the leap to being better than Delaware State ,now its our conference is better than a bad American East conference, talk about moving the bar or should I say lowering the bar. It's not jealousy its frustration at the ignorance of posters like yourself who come across as blowhards saying their kid is a "great player". If your kid has committed to Stanford believing they have a legit shot at competing for an NCAA title then there must be an undiscovered clueless gene, if your kid committed to Stanford for a great campus, great academics, and above average lacrosse then good for them they made a great decision. I don't personally hold the RPI ranking in high regard but its interesting someone would use that as a barometer when they are trying to show how Stanford is a top program.

That list is subjective like most other rankings type lists....Wagner with a 27 RPI??

You’re mixing up many posters in this latest post. My point is simple...Stanford has a new coach, a good 2019 class, a great 2020 and 2021 class. They have had some success beating very good programs and they are in the top 20-25 range the last two years. Over the next six, I see them moving into the 10-20 range with more upside than down.

No, it is not subjective at all.

With 25% of a teams RPI being based upon their own record is not good for womens lacrosse. The disparity between talent level on the D1 level in womens lacrosse is way too big of a gap. So take Wagner with an RPI of 27. Their record was very good, but have you seen the level of teams they played? Number 30 Hofstra beat them by 13 goals and Princeton beat them by 12 in the first round of the NCAA's. Then 50% of their RPI is based upon their opponents record....Mount St Mary's and Fairfield both had great records as well, but again the level of teams they played is not strong at all. Again, Hofstra beat Fairfield by 9. I am not trying to pick on Wagner or any of the other schools listed hear but again, RPI is a measure that to me is subjective in womens lacrosse because the talent level is so wide that the RPI parameters do not work out...

You’re mixing up many posters in this latest post. My point is simple...Stanford has a new coach, a good 2019 class, a great 2020 and 2021 class. They have had some success beating very good programs and they are in the top 20-25 range the last two years. Over the next six, I see them moving into the 10-20 range with more upside than down.”

You actually just can’t help yourself . There are other programs with better recruiting classes . No one except you think there is an impact player in Stanford’s 2021 class . Seems obvious your kid is one of them , are they even an impact player on their high school team . Again with the word great , you truly are delusional and if the end up top 20 that is in no ones definition of great . If you want to be honest say great academics mediocre lax .

[That list is subjective like most other rankings type lists....Wagner with a 27 RPI??[/quote]

No, it is not subjective at all.
[/quote]
With 25% of a teams RPI being based upon their own record is not good for womens lacrosse. The disparity between talent level on the D1 level in womens lacrosse is way too big of a gap. So take Wagner with an RPI of 27. Their record was very good, but have you seen the level of teams they played? Number 30 Hofstra beat them by 13 goals and Princeton beat them by 12 in the first round of the NCAA's. Then 50% of their RPI is based upon their opponents record....Mount St Mary's and Fairfield both had great records as well, but again the level of teams they played is not strong at all. Again, Hofstra beat Fairfield by 9. I am not trying to pick on Wagner or any of the other schools listed hear but again, RPI is a measure that to me is subjective in womens lacrosse because the talent level is so wide that the RPI parameters do not work out...[/quote]

The RPI is not subjective. It is not perfect but the Top 20 - 25 is pretty accurate. That said, there simply is not enough talent to go around. The top Programs bring in the Top Recruits / Players every year and that is why The Top Programs remain the same from year too year.

You agree with who , yourself . You are ridiculous , predicting that the 2021 class will be top 3 when that class is not even close to being done . Typical YJ parent , do you even realize how pretentious you are . Not one of those LI recruits has been an impact player on the high school level why would it be different at the next level. The best 2021 LI recruits were on the UA LI team and and has been said before it’s a weak age group . The better LI players heading to the west coast are going to USC and honestly they are not “ great” but still better than the link impact high school players heading to the other west coast team. Sadly maybe Stanford will end up with the top 2021 class but as many of the college coaches have recognized it’s a bad year . Honest question for you Mr. South Shore dad do you really think the 2021 class is in the same ball park as the 2020 class .

An impact playr at one high school could be a nothing burger at another.

I am reading all this crazy banter about Stanford and the 2021 class. This sadly starts to single out my daughter, as she was one of the first players who committed to go there.

At the end of the day, I really could care less where this incoming class ranks or what people think about Stanford’s lacrosse program or its future. But at this point people are singling out players and talking garbage about them. I am not a part of this banter back and forth on this topic and I ask that you people please move along, especially the peron(s) arguing pro Stanford. I appreciate your sentiment, yet my best guess is your daughter isn’t going there, and you will never win an argument on an anonymous forum.

My daughter chose to go to Stanford, and I am happy for her. It is a great academic school and a good lacrosse program. Some of her friends chose to go there as well, and I am happy for that as well. All the 2021’s will find a great fit both lacrosse wise and academically. It is a sad day when adults feel the need to single out and disparage young women. Next subject please…

Why is it sadly, why the personal attacks? There is a bigger world than just LI, Stanford has 10 in this class, 8 players not from LI along with 2 of the top 2021 players from LI. Perhaps the reason they say Stanford has a top class is that the top 40 according to IL are almost all committed and Stanford (and Maryland) got more of them than anyone.

Certainly will respect this request. Might be a reply to the previous post pending but will honor your request.

Sorry if this posts twice, but will respect your request. Might be a post pending in response to one above but will move on...

Again with the “best” , “ great” to describe the Stanford recruits . Sorry but it’s pretentious and have to say shows their insecurity to have to constantly keep stating it. The nothing burger comment is hilarious in that again this poster is so delusional that the reason their kid is not an impact player on their high school team is that their school team is so strong that the best players on other teams would be a back up on this superstar loaded team that can’t get off LI. It’s “sadly” because you use IS lax rankings ( which I think are political and generally useless and guarantee you more of the Stanford recruits will be added so IS lax can say the sport is growing) yet you claim two of the best from LI who are not even on your sacred list . This will be the last I post about Stanford as I do understand the one parent is in a difficult spot being in with a clearly insecure dad who needs to tell us how great every team his kid plays on is. Good luck to them and as I have said many times all the girls going there have set themselves up to be very successful in life , great campus , great weather , great academics.

If you’re so happy for your daughter and where she committed, then get off botc and stop arguing with people. We all see you did the same for your other daughter and as she is a good player, she is not elite or game changing just like this one. What you need to understand is that lacrosse is not just about your princess, but about the whole group of girls and most importantly the coach and leadership. Be happy your girls are both at great schools and stop arguing with people on here. Neither one has a shot at a National Championship, but both will receive a great education and college experience. You need to move on and find a new hobby!

For you to insinuate that you think you know who’s posting this garbage is just ignorant! The person you think it is has never been on this crappy forum! A bunch of keyboard tough guys! Instead of being happy for the girls you feel the need to disrespect them. You need mental health support. The man you accuse of being on here praising his daughters and Stanford would do absolutely anything for you, even after you drug his daughters through the mud! Move on lost!!!

Dragged not drug ,so South Shore . Just kidding . It’s obviously someone posting who has a kid going there or they are dangerously obsessed with this group of commits. If you are going to come on this site and claim your daughter is part of a group of great players expect some blowback or better yet just keep it to yourself.

Where is the most current commitment list?

First off some of the college coaches have not gone after this age very hard , UNC , Cuse , ND as an example of a few . Some of the actual commitments I am sure the college coaches are excited about but I am basing my opinion on what I have seen and conversations with coaches in LI who generally feel the 2021 class is weak . It’s not to say there are not some very good players but honestly there aren’t many stand outs in this year. Are there any decent high school teams out there where the obviously best player is going to be a junior this year , I can tell you a bunch where it was a junior last year . By stand outs I mean players that have been or will be the best player on their high school team for more than 1 year , have made most if not all the “ all star “ teams with combined ages they have tried out for , have received the highest accolades of any player on their high school team . [/quote]

Smithtown East, their 2021s are a very good class and contain the best players on the team. Two 21s have already committed to TOP schools and are fantastic lacrosse players and have been for years. There are 5 more 21s on that team that will again contribute this year and will also play in on competitive college teams.

Other schools that jump to mind where their top players are 21s, ESM, BBP, Mt Sinai, Ward Melville, Sayville (although not a top program like the others listed), WHB, Mattituck. I think the LI 21s have shown to be pretty darn good.

Smithtown East, their 2021s are a very good class and contain the best players on the team. Two 21s have already committed to TOP schools and are fantastic lacrosse players and have been for years. There are 5 more 21s on that team that will again contribute this year and will also play in on competitive college teams.

Other schools that jump to mind where their top players are 21s, ESM, BBP, Mt Sinai, Ward Melville, Sayville (although not a top program like the others listed), WHB, Mattituck. I think the LI 21s have shown to be pretty darn good.[/quote]

Leaving out the obvious, Manhasset- with two Jrs that have been big contributors since freshman year!

First off some of the college coaches have not gone after this age very hard , UNC , Cuse , ND as an example of a few . Some of the actual commitments I am sure the college coaches are excited about but I am basing my opinion on what I have seen and conversations with coaches in LI who generally feel the 2021 class is weak . It’s not to say there are not some very good players but honestly there aren’t many stand outs in this year. Are there any decent high school teams out there where the obviously best player is going to be a junior this year , I can tell you a bunch where it was a junior last year . By stand outs I mean players that have been or will be the best player on their high school team for more than 1 year , have made most if not all the “ all star “ teams with combined ages they have tried out for , have received the highest accolades of any player on their high school team . [/quote]

Smithtown East, their 2021s are a very good class and contain the best players on the team. Two 21s have already committed to TOP schools and are fantastic lacrosse players and have been for years. There are 5 more 21s on that team that will again contribute this year and will also play in on competitive college teams.

Other schools that jump to mind where their top players are 21s, ESM, BBP, Mt Sinai, Ward Melville, Sayville (although not a top program like the others listed), WHB, Mattituck. I think the LI 21s have shown to be pretty darn good.

Is this a joke or are you just that ignorant about the teams you are posting about. Lets take it in reverse order .Mattituck, I dont believe that they even have a 2021 who has played on the varsity and if they did it was not a significant amount , lost like 8 starting seniors to graduation and their best players the past years were sisters none of whom are 2021 ,one of which is a 2020 who was an AA last year.
WHB You think that a 2021 player on that team is better than the 2020 2x AA/ U19 player. The only player who would be in the conversation was her cousin who graduated last year.
Sayville Yes the best players are most likely 2021 which is the reason they are not in the conversation of a top team and also the reason they did not have a player on the UA team or top schoolgirls team( at least I dont think so as I could not find both rosters)
Ward Melville Debatable as to the best player but its possible , will be a down year for them as they are not very good this year.
Sinai/Esm putting them together as they are similar in regard to best player. Yes both those goalies are very good and that is the strength of the 2021 class in general on LI but neither are the best players on their teams
as both Sinai and ESM have 2 of the better players in the country in the 2020 age group.That said comparing goalies and field players is never really easy.
BBP the top 3 players on that team last year were 2020 so why would that change this year.

Including BBP, Mattituck,WHB in your argument just shows you have absolutely no idea.

Smithtown East, their 2021s are a very good class and contain the best players on the team. Two 21s have already committed to TOP schools and are fantastic lacrosse players and have been for years. There are 5 more 21s on that team that will again contribute this year and will also play in on competitive college teams.

Other schools that jump to mind where their top players are 21s, ESM, BBP, Mt Sinai, Ward Melville, Sayville (although not a top program like the others listed), WHB, Mattituck. I think the LI 21s have shown to be pretty darn good.

Is this a joke or are you just that ignorant about the teams you are posting about. Lets take it in reverse order .Mattituck, I dont believe that they even have a 2021 who has played on the varsity and if they did it was not a significant amount , lost like 8 starting seniors to graduation and their best players the past years were sisters none of whom are 2021 ,one of which is a 2020 who was an AA last year.
WHB You think that a 2021 player on that team is better than the 2020 2x AA/ U19 player. The only player who would be in the conversation was her cousin who graduated last year.
Sayville Yes the best players are most likely 2021 which is the reason they are not in the conversation of a top team and also the reason they did not have a player on the UA team or top schoolgirls team( at least I dont think so as I could not find both rosters)
Ward Melville Debatable as to the best player but its possible , will be a down year for them as they are not very good this year.
Sinai/Esm putting them together as they are similar in regard to best player. Yes both those goalies are very good and that is the strength of the 2021 class in general on LI but neither are the best players on their teams
as both Sinai and ESM have 2 of the better players in the country in the 2020 age group.That said comparing goalies and field players is never really easy.
BBP the top 3 players on that team last year were 2020 so why would that change this year.

Including BBP, Mattituck,WHB in your argument just shows you have absolutely no idea.

[/quote]

Agree about Mattituck.
Agree about WHB... not even close. 2020 super stud is the best by far the best.
Agree about Sayville.
It is not debatable at Ward Melville. The best player by far is a 2021. (best player last year as well).
Disagree with assessment and putting Mt. Sinai and ESM together. and can't really compare goalies to field players. Call the goalie the most important player.
Agree about BBP

Agree about Mattituck.
Agree about WHB... not even close. 2020 super stud is the best by far the best.
Agree about Sayville.
It is not debatable at Ward Melville. The best player by far is a 2021. (best player last year as well).
Disagree with assessment and putting Mt. Sinai and ESM together. and can't really compare goalies to field players. Call the goalie the most important player.
Agree about BBP
[/quote]

Garden City and Manhasset...

Garden City and Manhasset...[/quote]

Are always loaded.

Are always loaded.


Garden City and Manhasset are well coached. The players play in a great system with a good supporting cast. Individually the players on both GC and Manhasset are not stand outs.

"Smithtown East, their 2021s are a very good class and contain the best players on the team. Two 21s have already committed to TOP schools and are fantastic lacrosse players and have been for years. There are 5 more 21s on that team that will again contribute this year and will also play in on competitive college teams."

But Smithtown East never wins anything, always the bridesmaid, never the bride. Even with the talent they have/had. Coaching is the problem there.

OK! Manhasset hss two jrs who have contributed since freshman year. 1 with many accolades. The jealousy always shows through.

You got that right. They can not help themselves.

Facts do not matter, they will keep changing the criteria and moving the bar to keep with their desire to belittle the 2021s. Manhasset and GC both had 2021s on the UA team with the 2020s, but they do not seem to count.

I’ve seen this team for years, and they have had a lot of talent not utilized correctly. 2 2021s are skilled, smart players. They lost some gritty seniors who will be a big loss. They have a few younger superstars in the making including an excellent goalie who was out for the season with a knee injury and a great draw girl who had a back injury. They will have a good team this year but I think Northport will be the team to beat once again! In fact, wasn’t East the only team to beat, and beat soundly, the state champions in regular play?

Awesome YouTube videos about D1lacrosse , look up Jessie James west on YouTube he transferred from d1to d3. Reality about the hype . Also his buddy Stelios and himself about the work being a d1 to a D3 player . I can’t see a kid having a life and playing a sport where there’s no future in and excel in college at the same time 6 days a week 2,3 times a day with practice film and workouts and hardly get any scholarships. FACT !!!!!

What is "FACT"?

DI Athletics is certainly not for everyone but there are many DI student athletes who do thrive and grow while playing a DI sport in college.

[/quote]Garden City and Manhasset...[/quote]

Are always loaded. who The PARENTS?[/quote][/quote]

They have a few younger superstars in the making including an excellent goalie who was out for the season with a knee injury and a great draw girl who had a back injury. [/quote]


Tee Hee!!

This may be the densest post ever on this site. So you're saying that every kid that plays a D1 sport has not life and doesn't excel in college? That's absolutely ridiculous.

Are always loaded. who The PARENTS?[/quote][/quote]

They have a few younger superstars in the making including an excellent goalie who was out for the season with a knee injury and a great draw girl who had a back injury. [/quote]


Tee Hee!![/quote]

Green is a great color but it is ugly on you.

The guy calling his kid a future superstar is about as pretentious as the GC parents are thought to be . The only thing your kid seems to be in the making for is the child of an obnoxious dad.

Not just Garden City but the whole island is full of classless, obnoxious and crazy parents. Is there an equivalent name for Masshole to describe theses kind of people from Long Island?

FLIDs

With fall tournaments starting this weekend will coaches be watching 21s much or will they have moved on to the 22s?

The short answer is both, depending on the tier of the team. There are still many 2021 roster spots open across the board. Only a few of the top programs have finalized their 2021 class, and there are many//most mid level and lower Div 1's still looking. Other than committing their top 2 or 3 girls many D1 teams wanted to see girls one more time during the fall before giving offers. Likewise some girls with late offers wanted to hold out until they play the fall so that they will have the most options. D2-3 schools will look at 2021's from this fall until next fall. That being said there will be coaches at the most of the 2022 A team brackets games, and some at the B bracket games. They will use the fall to for preliminary IDing potential talent, and exclude others who don't fit what they are looking for. I think the focus will still be on the 2021's, but expect a fair number of coaches at the 2022's top team games.

Anyone know or have an opinion on what schools in the top 50 have been slow to recruit? We were at a showcase this past weekend and there were a ton of high D1 coaches still watching. Would love to hear your opinions.

Think a lot of schools went slow but a lot of the top D1 schools are done or close to it. The one's watching may have been looking at a small group of girls for their last one or two spots or they are watching their commits.

There are still a ton of spots open but the top 10 is basically done at this point.

So what's the going rate for D1 Scholarships % wise?

Schools don't go slow. The coaches know the players that they want and they go after the players and let the player and parents know that they are offering a spot if the player wants it (if the player has legitimate interest they will discuss scholarship etc...) . When Coaches see the players they want commit to another school the coaches move down their list. Obviously most coaches have most of the same players ranked high so they are not out there offering spots to random players if the coach thinks they still have a chance at the player they really want.

There is no going rate. At the top programs the top recruit can receive a significant scholarship 75% and up. The number two may also receive a decent amount. From there it will drop down 20 - 30% and then less and none. There is no set formula but the top players will be offered a good deal.

Fully funded programs have 12 scholarships total. in theory that would give the coach 3 per year (not always the case due to several factors red-shirts, transfers, upperclassmen "earning" additional $$ etc...).

If the coach has 3 to divide between 9 incoming freshmen it might look something like this: (athletic money only)

# 1 gets 75%
# 2 gets 50%
# 3 gets 50%
# 4 gets 30%
# 5 gets 25%
# 6 gets 25%
# 7 gets 25%
# 8 gets 20%
# 9 gets 0%

The schools that offer you a spot gives you an idea of where you stand in relation to all recruits, what the school offers gives you an idea of where you stand in relation to other recruits at that school.

If a top tier recruit is willing to drop down in the tier of program the may very well receive significant $$. For example a player receiving scholarship offers from Northwestern, Boston College, North Carolina and Maryland would most likely receive more $$ from schools traditionally outside the top 20. The same holds true for academic $$ a student with 31 or 32 ACT all AP and Honors and a GPA in the high 90's might not get any academic $$ at Duke, ND, Northwestern etc... (don't think IVY's give academic $$) but that same student could receive a lot of merit based $$$ if they drop down a bit academically.

I agree with much of the above 2 statements and only want to add that many players that stay "in state" might not receive much athletic $ at all. That is helpful for a coach that might want to use additional scholarship funding for the out of state players they are recruiting.

And, how does it work for a public school? Are they giving percentages based on the in-state tuition rate, out-of-state tuition rate or does it depend on the school?

If you are in-state it is based on a percent of in-state tuition , if you are out of state it is based on a percent of out of state costs.

Was offered 25% for an out of State Big Ten Public School on everything - Tuition Room and Board,

Also offered a set $ for an in state school which equated to a 25%

The out of state offer doesn't even bring it down to in State.

Heard in PA they are trying to pass that In-State Tuition rates may be given to Student Athletes....

Thanks - that would be a pretty significant offer...

Well then the schools in PA would no longer be in the NCAA .

Why?

Essentially you would be giving all out of state athletes a scholarship without trying to count it as a scholarship giving the Pa schools an unfair advantage so the NCAA will not allow it .

I'm not familiar with the specific NCAA rules, but it seems unlikely this could be done for athletes only.

Some public universities have merit based programs that give in state tuition rates or generous merit money to attract out of state students. It's fairly automatic for those meeting the GPA and SAT/ACT criteria. My daughter considered offers from a couple of public university lacrosse program and was told she'd likely qualify for $10-$15k merit money in addition to athletic money, something she would qualify for whether or not she was an athlete.

I heard that the Yale men's team has made an effort to recruit strong players from less affluent areas and Yale is giving these players substantial need based financial aid. So the Ivy's give no athletic scholarships, but half of the Yale championship team is getting need based scholarships. On one hand that is great, but on the other it feels like they are really working the system.

Yale make an effort to recruit strong players.

LOL how dare they work the system giving spots to middle class kids instead of rich prep school kids whose parents can easily pay full price!!!

Here's how things work at ivy league schools. They have large endowments. Merit aid for every student is determined using a sliding scale based on parent income, other siblings in college, etc. Merit aid is available for family incomes well beyond what's considered low income. A family with an income of say $100k-120k can qualify for enough merit money for an ivy league to cost the same or less than a state public university. This is not secret information - anyone can run the numbers on each school's cost calculator. Families with incomes of $150k-$200k can qualify for merit aid at some ivies, but even with $30k in merit money a school like Yale still costs an additional $40k a year.

Ivies don't give athletic scholarships, which is a disadvantage to them recruiting non-wealthy kids, so I'd expect their coaches in every sport use the generous merit aid to their advantage. Just like public school coaches bring up merit money available to strong students, and other private schools mention merit money that can be available in addition to or instead of athletic money. I would not call that working the system, but I imagine the mediocre wealthy kid who isn't offered a spot because it goes to middle class kid who is a better player might see it that way.

Need at Yale is "Need Based" not "merit based".

Yes, correct, multitasking and misspoke. Ivy aid is all need based and they have cost calculators on their websites. Other privates do the same, but the income cutoff is generally lower. Some publics and privates (non-ivy) have merit aid that can be combined with athletic money.

Out of curiosity I just did my calculations at Yale.. I would get $22,500 in need based aid. We Live in NY metro area, I own a house with mortgage, 200K annual income with moderate savings..
No too bad.. now if only she could get in...

You would get more. Know a few people who have gone through the process. At 200k expect over 50%

Try it again but assume that you pay down your mortgage with most of your savings, and take out a HELOC so that you can quickly access money for emergencies. The richest schools generally don't look at how much equity you have in your house, and don't look at 401k's either. Last I checked, Harvard and Yale are actually stingy compared to other wealthy schools. Try it with Princeton, Columbia and Penn.

We’re getting 45k in aid at Penn on a $170k income. Makes like a state school tuition.

Just ran the numbers for Princeton. $300,000 adjusted gross income, $60,000 in savings, $20,000 in investments. I don't think Princeton looks at retirement savings 401K etc... and they do not look at equity in your home (primary residence).

With 3 kids in college it will cost you aprox: $20,000

With 2 kids in college it will cost you aprox: $28,000

With 1 kid in college it will cost you aprox: $50,000

The Bucknell Coach just stepped down, how does this effect commits?

This is not exclusive to ivies. Hopkins, Stanford and Northwestern and some others are very similar. In many cases you can get more in aid than you can receive from a lacrosse scholarship at those schools.

Maybe that’s the reason why he quit/fired. In addition to the losing record he flat out couldn’t recruit. My daughter got a call from him on day one and let’s just say he did a horrible job selling the program. Those recruits can go back on the road again or just stay (God knows why with this car crash) . Luckily for those girls it happened now and not in three months time.

This could affect commits. Publicly, the coach won't de-commit a player, however, if they do not like the player previously recruited, they will tell the athlete that it is not a good fit hinting and pretty much telling them to look elsewhere. I've experienced this with a few of my players but it is not always the case...

I think these schools are very generous with incomes under $100-$120k, but they are not equal to some ivies for higher incomes. With my oldest, our calculated need based aid for Harvard and Princeton was noticeably more than for Stanford ($160-$170k income). If I recall, we wouldn't have qualified for any need based aid at Duke. With my second child, the need based aid at these schools calculated to a lot more because they split the expected family contribution between all kids in college. So, if they determine your family can afford $50k for college and you have two kids in college, you get $25k more in need based aid than if just the one child in college.

One thing to be aware of is that if your income rises, you may not see much of it by the time you pay taxes and you family contribution for college goes up because need based aid will decline accordingly. On the flip side, if your income goes down then your need based aid will go up. A lot of kids won't have the grades, test scores and AP classes to get into these schools even as athletes, especially at some of the ivies, but it is worth looking into with an academic high achiever.

Why would they get more than what the school's cost calculator says? The amount of aid depends a lot on how many family members are in college. I don't think everyone qualifies for that much with $200k income.

Didn't know they committed anyone, figured most low level D1's are waiting. But if they did, those commits would have to wait for the new coach to be hired and see if that coach is honoring the commitment, and re-negotiate the athletic aide if any was offered.

Great points. I want to add that College Coaches will ask point blank to club coaches before and after Sept 1 can a family afford an Ivy and it does factor in if they extend a spot on their lacrosse teams and at what level on the academic scale.

Not accurate at all. In fact, a family that can't afford an Ivy is the best candidate for an Ivy if they are a stud athlete and an excellent student. As an earlier post indicated at Ivy's and places like Northwestern many student athletes will get more $$$ in need based aid than they will in Athletic scholarship $$$.

This is true. My kid who is a great player, and even better student focused on the Ivies specially for the reason that our income was under 200k. We knew that the need based aid would be equivalent to a 60% scholarship. Ivies are the way to go if your income is under 200k or over a million . In between that, it gets tough.

Hope that the new coach honors the commits. Is the program fully funded? Bucknell is a program that should be better.

Agreed if we all lived in the same area with the same cost of living. 200k in the northeast is very different than in North Dakota.

What are your thoughts about the D1 process. Think they are done? A bunch of camps left. moneymakers? or real deal?

Top D1 schools mostly done. Mid and low D1 still going.

Under the current set of rules, does anyone think that there will be poaching or decommitting in the 2021 class? Some schools, like Stanford, moved very fast in taking top talent while some top programs still have a spot or two left to fill. What prevents a school from reaching out to a commit elsewhere with an offer. It happens on the boy's teams all the time. In the rush to get girls committed, and for girls to get a spot, I assume some hasty decisions were made.

Why did the coach step down? Have they hired a new coach?

At this point most of the D1 Money is gone in respect to getting new offers from this point on. Scholarship offers have either been accepted, or are still awaiting answers. Only spots left now are just that, spots, with no money on teams. That being said, some very good teams still have open spots, and if your daughter is interested in a school a winter clinic is not a bad idea. (I would have your daughter email/contact the coach to ask if they are done with their 2021 recruits or are they still recruiting the class prior to registering, most coaches will be honest about this).

Honest?!!

By my estimate (based on a ton of research) approx. 500 girls from the 2021 class have verbally committed. I would put schools in three (maybe obvious) tiers
Tier 1 - mostly / totally done, perhaps room for one more (ACC, BIG 10, most Ivies, top of Pac12 and Big East, and most other top 30 schools)
Tier 2 - next group of schools that have gotten after recruiting - maybe another 20 - 30 schools that have 3 - 5 recruits
Tier 3 - just starting, 0-2 recruits, approx 50 - 60 D1 schools
so depending on what your are shooting for, its currently anywhere from a tight squeeze to lots of room available ...

Would your tiers be mostly based on rankings? Wondering what distinguishes two from three.

You did a ton of research? There are 117 D1 programs. Tier 3 is half the programs, Tier 2 brings you to 90 schools. So based on your research most programs are just starting recruitment????

I would say the Top Tier or Tier 1 programs are the teams / programs that finish the year in the Top 20 every year. Tier 2 or second tier programs are the programs that are competitive and finish in the Top 20 from time to time. Tier 3 programs are developing programs.

Hopefully as the sport continues to grow we will see more programs become stronger. As of now, the strongest 10 - 20 programs tend to bring is the best talent. West coast schools along with Colorado and Denver are becoming more and more competitive and Arizona State will continue to improve. Until there is more talent available the second and third tier east coast schools will continue to struggle. The best players will be given opportunities at the best programs as well as at the "sexy, cool, different" schools (Colorado, USC, Stanford, ASU etc...). Michigan will also become a major player.

Tier 1 teams 2020.... IMHO


Maryland
North Carolina
Boston College
Northwestern
Syracuse
Virginia
Princeton
Notre Dame
Florida
Penn
Penn State
Duke
Stony Brook
Loyola
Hopkins
Georgetown
JMU
Stanford
USC
Denver

Who else?? Michigan? Dartmouth? Virginia Tech? Colorado? Hofstra? Towson? Navy?