Opening a new thread for the fourth graders joining the lacrosse fold with a graduation year of 2019 or 2020.

The Express Boys 2019 Orange won the LI Lax Fest and the Forsberg Tournament. Congratulations to this group and good luck for many years ahead!

Has anyone heard about this team called the Dune Dawgs? They seem to be doing well against the 2019/2020 teams out there.

The Dune Dawgs link appears to the right side of the display in the Long Island Clubs content island. Their club site hosts four team landing areas : 2018 Green, 2019 Green, 2019 Blue, and 2020 Green.

The following club overview appears on the Dune Dawgs home page: "The directors of HAVOC Lacrosse and The Long Island Dune Dawgs Lacrosse programs are excited to announce the combining of our programs. This merger will ultimately meet the needs of ALL athletes! HAVOC Lacrosse will remain a "travel" team challenging the needs of all developing athletes, while our Dune Dawgs Lacrosse program will be a "select" team, challenging the needs of more advanced athletes."

Havoc Dune Dawgs are the bomb- Such a great team 2019 really have some awesome kids and talent-

its a great program with awesome coaching from coach taylor from dowling

Congratulations to Team 91's fourth grade orange boys (2020) on their win at the Skull and Bones tournament last weekend. Well done with this young group!

Congratulations also go out to the Team 91 sixth grade (2018) orange team for their win at the Yale Bulldog event.

Congrats to your 2020 team; however, there is a page for your 2018 team. This isn't the one......

Just saw the team 91 2020 team win the Santa Jam. Team is awesome! they beat the Express 25-3, and they beat their own 2nd teir team 15-1 and another team 17-1! They are great, they have these two kids that never leave the field and the coaches just keep letting them score all the time. They are awesome they team just keeps scoring goals no matter how bad they are beating a team. They killed express and killed their own white team by 15 goals at least. They even scored behind the back with 5 seconds left in the express game even though the score was 24-3. The express kids were crying...it must have been an awesome feeling for all those 91 coaches and parents to crush and embarass fellow 10 year old long island lacrosse players.

I wish my kid could be on that team, but my sons coach doesn't allow that, something about sportsmanship and honoring the game...oh wait...that's what it's suppose to be all about right?

This can and does happen in the younger age groups when teams have just formed. As for the acceptable margin of victory, ten runs in baseball/softball is a kill rule and six goals in soccer form the gentleman's limit. Honestly, we have never seen a handshake rule in lacrosse, but cannot imagine that a ten-goal limit is hard to follow.

Sportsmanship occurs even in lopsided games. You can have players switch positions etc... A coach with character does not allow players to score behind the back or without making several passes. This coach did none of these things, he and the rest of the staff just encouraged the boys without regard for the score. the games were 25 minutes long...its simple to not score 25 goals in that time. If I was a parent on that team I would be upset my son was part of it.

I could not even imaginge watching that game, what does that teach a child about sportmanship and team work. As a parent, I would be ashamed, how sad for adults/coaches to teach kids this. Winning is great, what an awesome feeling, but is it everything? Thats what these young players are taught. They do not know how to lose and most importantly they do not know what it feels like to lose. "GOOD CHARACTER" thats what we teach our children, on and off the field it is what that child portrays, slaughtering a team just because you can does not portray GOOD CHARACTER. In the real world, good character is what really counts!

It only "just happens" because coaches ALLOW it to happen. Nothing in life just happens, it is a direct result of action or inaction. As for my PAL team, if we were ahead by 8 or 10 I can assure you not another goal would be scored because I would give them plays to follow that quite simply would be very difficult to execute at their age group. Someone doesn't follow the play to full execution and decides to score, they sit the rest of the game and they know that BEFORE they go out on the field to execute the play. This, I believe not only teaches them sportsmanship, but will make them a better team next year, and that year will come quickly. I think those coaches that allow that got beat up in high school and it's their way of getting back, since they can't give back!. Just my 2 cents.

Although I agree with the posts about running up the score, I must say sometimes kids DO NOT LISTEN when coaches tell them not to shoot, make extra passes and so on. I do not have a son on team 91 but in the 7th 8th grade championship game of the Santa jam their team was winning by about 10 with less then a minute to play and the coaches were screaming not to shoot. One player took a shot as time ran out and both the coaches went right up and got in his face. Tells me its more the team/coaches of the 2020 team then the 91 program

The really unfortunate part of the situation is that the coach of that team is a division 1 college lacrosse coach and a director in the 91 program.

Sad state of affairs when it comes from the top. And to beat your own programs team by that many goals shows little character.

How can all those parents go home and not be upset at what their child is being subjected to.

Agreed, coaching is everything, they are supposed to be role models......teaching lifes lessons on and off the field....Happy New Year!

I've seen both sides of this.

We've played on a club team that on occasion when they could score , would score, regardless of the score. This normally occurred when playing other club travel teams, the coach had no problem running it up against another high level competitive team. Maybe a way of proving their programs superiority I guess. In theory getting them all ready for what the real competition will be, No 4 goal rule in JV, Varsity and beyond. On the flip side when this same team played a town team he would hold them back, we even switched half the team and swapped pennies at the half to make it even. The kids were always very respectful and never disrespected any competition, they just realized overall they were a better lacrosse team and tried to play at the highest level.

I've also seen teams play keep away for an entire half while the coaches are yelling don't shoot. This in my opinion has been much more humiliating to the kids as the run around for 20 minutes and never touch the ball.

Now regards to this specific 91 team, they’ve been doing this for a while and have created a poor situation. I think it was second grade, they entered the 91 team as a town team (Shoreham) at ISA and we heard the parents bragging about winning all their games by at least 20 goals. They were removed from the league. (This was before the ISA, 91 alliance).

My son is on the 2020 B team and to be fair the express beat us 18-1 in the Halloween tournament. That same tournament an express coach also director in the 6th grade division won 30-0. It happens everywhere. These are select teams afterall.Last year in the spring league express fourth grade team beat our 91 B 3rd grade team 30-0!!The coach of the express team that got steamrolled yesterday was the same coach that did it to us last year! THat was not honoring the game .. was it? Because of that we stayed and watched the 2020 team play! You can not just honor the game when its convenient!!

Please allow BOTC to give you all a very different perspective on this "beat the snot" out of the opposition discussion. When we are talking about 15 and 20 goal wins in the course of a 30-to-45 minute match, we passed the sportsmanship exit many miles back.

Think about what you are buying as a parent for your child. You are a consumer of lacrosse services here and BOTC wants to challenge what you are buying.

When you sign-on for a club experience, you are "buying" experience :

• coaching experience,
• training experience,
• sometimes collegiate or professional playing experience,
• perhaps college connect experience ...
• but also you are purchasing marketplace experience.

What this last bit implies is that your club directors and coaches understand the competitive landscape and place their teams in tournaments which have been properly sized-up for their competitive level.

The argument that flows from this is as follows : "Well, we didn't know that the competition level was weak."

Quite frankly, BOTC finds that argument to be rubbish. It is your JOB as a club director and club coach to have these answers after researching where you are placing your team(s). Anything less shows weak research and undermines the value of what you are purchasing as a family.

So, you see, the problem is not completely controlling what happens on the field - it also calls into question the quality of the coaching staff itself in evaluating talent and tournaments.

Think about it.

This statement is false. I know those coaches personally and I have watched and heard them yell "no shots" to their players and "everyone must touch the ball" Yesterday the TEAM 91 sidelines were silent. Regardless if it were true it doesn't make it right. There is no "eye for an eye" mentality when it comes to youth sports. Regardless of how adults feel about one another or which club teams hate the other. The kids are the losers in this situation and that is unacceptable.

great point. Well said.

I wouldn't want to be a kid on that team. Only 2 kids get the ball and never come off the field? That's a pathetic display of coaching. Nice job teaching teamwork and sportsmanship.

well said BOTC, we have watched these "elite teams" beat up their competition, we have been one of the teams being beat up on by "Team 91" as a parent, I have to stand on the side lines and listen to the oppossing teams parents encourage their players to keep scoring, I know that they are paying to WIN. It is discouraging, degrading.....I am proud of the fact that as a team, our players rise to the occassion, but am saddened by the fact that Team 91 has to win at all costs........always be nice to everyone on the way up, because it's those same people/players you will see on the way back down my friends.

My sons team played and lost to this team this weekend. They lost by a bunch of goals but the 91 parents were not jumping and screaming. They were not obnoxious, they cheered their kids like any parent would. My son and his team played hard and learned that if they lose its not the end of the world. Would it have been nice for 91 to not rub noses in it? Sure, but it would also not be fair for those kids to have to play keep away for every game they play. It would have been nice if that 91 team only played in their own division and not beat up on all the 5th grade teams too. The only team that I saw even come close was their own 5th grade B team...and even they lost 15 to 7. At one time I counted 7 coaches on their sidelines but rumor on the sideline was that's how they attract the all star players...play here and we will make you a coach so your kid plays for free and hotel tab is covered on the road. Scholarships in youth travel lacrosse...is this the norm or a new trick?

Its not false...look at the scores.

while I disagree with Spallina's "take no prisoners" attitude to youth lacrosse, I find it funny to hear Express parents complaining about it. Express teams have been humiliating weaker teams for years. My son has been on the losing side in 20+ goal blowouts by Express teams several times. Pot calling the kettle black.

is this a pal/town lacrosse thread or travel?? express beat my sons team by 30 plus last year in a game!! Sounds like the express are not used to it happening back to them. Two wrongs do not make a right tho!

First of all, so you are saying that two wrongs make a right? Is that what we are teaching our children? If so great job, you have succeeded.

Second, what you have failed to mention is that when the Express team was "STEAMROLLED" at the Santa Jam they had NO GOALIE! The goalie of the team that was "STEAMROLLED" had to leave unexpectedly for the final game and one of the team's players stood up to the plate with NO GOALIE EQUIPMENT other than a goalie stick. So your talented team scored 25 goals, shooting behind the back on a kid with a goalie stick who NEVER played goalie before. GREAT job 91 coaches!

Why would a coach or a parent let a 9 or 10 year old stand in goal with no goalie equipment against a team that shoots as hard as that 91 team does? if you ask me that is the travesty here..not the running up of the score.

actually it says two wrongs do NOT make a right ...read carefully. My son is Not on that 91 team, although I wish he was hahah. It happens.

Please, I coach a town team when we play our rival team, which we hate, when I yell pass the ball, the kiDS know that is code word to score and do a dance. Then I yell kid get over here right now. And I tell him ice cream on me. The coach new what he was doing.

Just to clarify: the boy in goal had on a cup, chest protector and throat guard. Neither the Express coaches nor the boy's parents would send him out there unprotected. But it is true that he has never played goal before. And thanks to Spallina, he never will again.

Maybe "Team 91" has something to prove against Express, who knows, what I do know is, I wouldn't want my son on a team where the coaches son is a player........conflict of interest and "Team 91" is everyones rival now!

ok people, yes 91 ran the score up high against the express, but when the score started to get away (up around 10) Express was playing very dirty and took a lot of penalties and every penalty was a fast break. Clearly 91 can play so most fast breaks ended in uncontested goals. Unfortunately my son was one of the boys on the express team and was upset with the result. But I have to be fair in saying that with the way some of the express defenders were playing, I can see why the dogs were not called off. running around cheap shotting people can be viewed as worse than scoring goals. And by the way the express coaches sons are on our team.

It will probably take more than 91 4th grade team beating up the express for the express to lose the title of everyones enemy. Not even close

Maybe I misunderstood the previous poster...when they wrote "NO GOALIE EQUIPMENT AT ALL EXCEPT A GOALIE STICK" and in all caps, I figured they meant...well he wore no goalie equipment...lol. Player safety should be paramount and if that means a team must step down and forfeit a game so be it. Whatever the case is it sounds like everyone is upset that spallina has a tremendous team this year, love it or hate it, it is a great group of players that for this year at least all came together. What is this team supposed to do, not play games because they always win? Running up the score so much may not be the best thing to do, but is also not the worst thing in the world, his kids play hard and they play fair and they had very few penalties. The behind the back passes and shots came across as cocky but it also kept the score lower than it could have been. I think most people smashing this team would jump at the chance to have their kid play with them.

Wow, what has happened to the once proud express orange? Making excuses for losses. What travel team doesn't have a backup goalie? It appears they are losing talent to 91 and Dune Dawgs. How does losing the starting goalie explain the lack of offense?

seriously only 3 goals from an express orange team?? My son is older and I have seen this instance more times than I can remember but thats a good question only 3 goals. My neighbors kid was a participant (express) in this game and said 91 had about 10 fast breaks as a result from penaltys.

Oh yes your right as long as most people means those that get free tuition, free hotels and cart blanc when it comes to how many 91 teams they are aloud to play on......and oh yes lets not forget every parent gets to be a coach.

91 is anything but fair. Too bad there aren't rules prohibiting kids from playing down. Where is the challenge in that? I wouldn't brag about a team who's "all star player" is not even playing his grade, as a matter of fact I am ashamed to be a part of the team, we will rethink our options for next year. As I am sure many other 91 parents will.

It is nice to hear a parent being honest! Dirty play by either team is wrong. When you are losing playing dirty just makes the loss that much worse. The coaches of BOTH teams are responsible for how this game was played and turned out, SHAME on all of them. Teach the game, winning will be that much sweeter!

Just because Some anonymous poster sticking up for 91 who says hes an express parent doesn't mean its true.

Or an express parent posing as a 91 parent! Guys its travel lacrosse lets move on! Worry about closing the 20 goal gap.According to people in the know 91 practices four days a week and play in a bunch of leagues probably not a coincidence there ahead of everyone by a good deal. Is it too much maybe but...

Dune Dawgs is a scam! Not a legit program! Their sales pitch is that every team is going to be coached by the same college coach, which is impossible! The kids that get cut from other organizations usually find a home with these kind of travel teams.I would beware of these overnight pop up travel programs. Do your research!!

As a parent of a Dune Dawgs player, I can vouch it is not a scam. Understand me clearly when I say I am not speaking for the organization. We've tried the other teams out there, and believe me, from what I see there is no better coaching for youth. The "other" organization has always seemed to benefit from the fact that most of the good players wanted to play there. I don't think that is the case anymore. Lacrosse is growing; therefore, new organizations will continue to "pop" up. Not every child, nor parent is interested in sending their kids to the high schools which benefit from these "feeder" programs. If you ever attended one of the Dune Dawgs practices, you would see what I mean.

As for saying these are usually kids that get cut from other programs, you must have not seen them play. Most of these kids would start at other programs. I'm sorry that this is anonymous, but my screen name is LaxDad14. If you have any issues with what I said, please get in touch with me. Unlike most of you, I will not hide behind an anonymous screen name.

My son has played against the Dune Dawgs this winter in rockstar, and I can say they are an excellent team. He had played with a few of the boys with another team last winter and I can say they are a great group of kids.

Registered users are required to register with a known e-mail address which is also used in the validation sequence. BOTC has other attributes known during the registration process that helps us to uniquely identify individual posters should questions be asked.

So, coming back to your post, we did miss your name - but we do like TMobile.

Why in the world would I put my name here? I however am not boasting about accountability and accusing other posters of hiding behind the anonymous tag,

By the way if you like Tmobile you must not use them...the service sucks.

If the Dune dawgs were such a great team, how come they didnt play in the santa jam? Oh wait a minute, their 2 "star players" play for 91. that sounds like a really fair deal to all the other dune dawg players who im sure would of loved to play? This just concretes my decision on staying with my town team and sit back and laugh at all you desperate people/ coaches!Keep on paying for these "elite teams", you will have to come and play for the school district sooner or later, which might be too late!

Fyi most college recruiting takes place with travel lacrosse..ask around. And if you honestly think your kids game is going to be elevated playing pal town lacrosse, I wish you the best, and you owe your child an appology in a couple years.

I don't think some of you guys quite get it. As a parent, wouldn't you want your child to play against top competition? As I've said before I'm not speaking for the organization, but as far as fifth grade goes it didn't make sense to play in the Santa Jam. So there you have it, my son plays on the fifth grade DD's. I think you can figure out the rest.

As far as staying on your local town team, whatever works for you, please do!!! Everyone has different expectations regarding their childs lacrosse experience. I know that my expectation is to always play the best competition. I think once you see the schedule for the fifth grade Dune Dawgs you will understand. It is the only way you get better!!!

Oh Sure - Dune Dawgs is quite a scam LMAO- Excellent program and coaching is top notch We are not a popup travel team we have played together for 3 years. All of our kids are top notch not just the 2 players you are talking about. We are very well rounded thats why we play up

This Board is becoming a complete joke. Every parent of every club comes on here bashing every other club. Parents we gotta get a grip. Go play catch with your kid

This type of chatter happens all the time during the holiday weeks heading into the Spring season. Give it a couple of weeks and the discussion will be very seriously grounded by the competitive games, leagues, and tournaments.

The "Santa Jam" is a two-bit small time local tournament designed by it's directors to make money. If a team, ANY TEAM, chooses not to play in it, why is that an issue. No one except the directors of ANY given organization know why a team plays or doesn't in a tournament. Stay playing town lacrosse, I'm sure it works fine for your child. Other kids need and want more opportunities to play. Why do you need to attack them?

You know as well as I do that people are jealous, and for the most part we know who they are. Get a life...stop your hating!! Dune dawns are here to stay, tell us in 10 years we're a "pop-up travel team". One thing we are is a group of parents who's sons LOVE to play lacrosse and LOVE to play it well.

There is no "sales pitch" and no one ever said EVERYONE is being coached by ONE coach. get your facts straight. COLLEGE LEVEL COACHING!! That is what we wanted and that is what we get from Dune Dawgs!

Thanks! Maybe next year you should consider having your son play with the Dune Dawgs, they are always looking for good players and GOOD PARENTS

Sour grapes much? Why don't you get over it already and move on...EVERYONE is sick of you whining about the Dune Dawgs...Boo-Hoo. Go coach your Express team...

Apparently, This Dune Dawg team is not a pop up travel team- just a bunch of kids who are a really great team and coached very well. As a 91 parent leaving the game today our kids were being told how to play like the Dune Dawgs and that they can learn from them-- actually it is an embrassment

The fifth grade 91 team is ok and probably in comparing what I have seen the 4th grade 91 team is a much much more talented team. Our Dune Dawg team is a very good team but , I too have concerns when college season starts and the asst coach is on the road or recruiting the weekends! Chances are all that glitters is not gold

This doesn't sound like a Dune Dawgs parent. Everyone knows what to expect and what they will get from the Dune Dawgs, superb coaching, dedicated coaching, and players who's talent grows by the day due to the leadership of their team.

Both teams played well today. The approach to coaching is different and shows on the field. The 91 boys played well today, their team was out coached. The Dune Dawgs love to play together and it shows.

No need to worry about that. Coach Mac is the head coach of the fifth grade team. "Asst. Coach" is the director of lacrosse operations for the Havoc DuneDawgs if I understand it correctly. Most youth teams play their spring/PAL leagues during the college season. Once that is over then we get back to business!! See, at the end of the day, HavocDD's are not trying to monopolize all the kids time. Playing with your PAL team is not frowned upon!!!!

I think you guys know I'm not one to get negative on here; however, I would hope this is not someone posing as a DD parent... After the game that was played today, I couldn't imagine someone speaking like this from our team.

Another thing, I wonder do people really understand this whole lacrosse scene??? Have you ever noticed that there is usually one or two tourneys in March, then nothing until June? Connect the dots people.... Lacrosse season (High School/College) is in full swing during this time, and travel does not get fully underway until it these seasons are over. Most coaches of any worth are usually busy with these types of teams during this period.

Not trying to be negative , just stating concerns, recruiting is almost every weekend during the summer. So far its going good

Understood. My older son has played two summers for Havoc. It was never an issue. Keep in mind that the game is an extension of practice. If properly coached and taught in practice, there shouldn't be much of an issue during the games. Now, if you've been over to the practices, you know the kids are being prepared properly. We will be fine......

Dune Dawgs, congratulations on you win against 91 yesterday. It's a little soon to start gloating though. When your 4th and 6th grade teams can compete against other clubs "A" teams, then you'll have something to pat yourselves on the back about. The 91 5th grade team is not a very strong team. Your teams are competing against younger teams or "B" teams in other age groups. You do seem to have recruited some fine players. It will be interesting to see how the teams develop.

Am I missing something here? No one is gloating!!! Most responses you see here from DD parents are simply responding to some of the outlandish posts trying to dismiss the program. If you look at the posts from yesterday, you wouldn't have even known who we played. We are not the type to come on here and put up scores and such.

The 2019 team has a group of parents and kids who genuinely enjoy playing with, as well as, being around one another. Most know and/or understand that there are two goals with this team. One is to continue improving, and the other...... Well we will keep that to ourselves.

another 91 apologist. Take your lumps and show some class. Your "other" teams are not that good either. You guys ripped DD then LOST to them. A little NY Jet Ryanesqe if you can follow. 91 are a lot of talk no matter what agre group we talk about. Im sure we will hear next that they were missing thier top players!!!!!! Booo-Hooooo

This sounds so immature! Really? glad you are having a wonderful experience with your Dune Dawg team, but come back down to reality. It sounds like the parents of what a 4th grade team seem to care too much about winning. Agreed, it's nice to beat a seasoned team like 91 but enough. If your that good and and that happy, you wouldn't have to convince everyone else, it would just show.

A 91er giving advice about being humble. How funny. Without a doubt the most obnoxious group most have encountered. Stop crying 91ers.

give me a break 91 dune dog express you guys are all nuts. it will be funny to look back at your 4 th grade rosters when your kids are in 9th and you will see more than two thirds will be new kids

Not a "91er" sorry, just speaking the truth. You keeping talking the talk, just walk the walk my lax friend

Just the fact they have a section for fourth graders is slightly weird...but then to argue over fourth graders pretty pathetic...and if i thought 8th grade was ridiculous

So true...

I was wondering if anyone knows of an available 3/4 grade team looking for players the team my son made is not putting out a team due to lack of commitment looking to stay in nassau county if possible Thanks

try contacting the Jesters, they often have spots available and are an inexpensive well run organization, my son joined a Jester team in mid season a few years ago and has been thrilled

you cant compare an organization like 91 to dune dogs!#1 really, it was an off season winter game! team 91 is an established lacrosse organization with many prior pro and college players/coaches! the dune dogs sell themselves with having 1 college coach(who is great), but it is not realistic to coach a whole program!please stop the comparison! but good luck with your program during its 1st year.

Stand corrected my friend- Dune DAWGS have been around for 3 years before merging with Havoc this past offseason. The orginal DUNE DAWGS were coached by parents who loved the game of lacrosse. So we are being coached by a college coach big deal- its all about the kids and the right coaching. Coaches shouldnt being yelling at kids for not winning or losing, or taking kids out. Even Professional coaches lose all the time

Check out fl$ Lite too. The 3/4 is something new but a quality organization with very good teams.

You can not compare your program to 91! when you pay your 1st tuition payment for 91, you dont get a surprise email after informing you that you have to pay extra for practices! now that sounds real fair and "all about the kids".It sounds more like every other travel program that you have to pay for! good luck with your travel program!And by the way, any realistic coach knows you cant win them all!

There is no comparision to the two teams. They are 2 totally different organiztions- just like every other lacrosse program out there- you choose who you would like to represent and who has the love of the game and who will let your kid play the most

Show me one post where we are trying to compare the DD's to 91. At this point, stop the pissing on other programs and worry about your son's team. Continue to practice and hopefully there will be competitive games during the season!!!

We will see when the real season hits and all your players go to their full time teams who they are more committed to! Enjoy your important wins on the off season! And make sure you check which team your players are playing for when you commit to summer tounaments!How are you going to explain to the other parents on your team on how you are scheduling your tournaments around certain players schedules! Sounds like a legit organization!good luck!

Once again, no one is gloating about winning in the offseason. If you want to get into that we can. Dune Dawgs last summer 20-0 in the tournaments. Playing the tournaments that most of you played in. Now regarding scheduling, I have no control nor input because I'm only a parent in the organization, but if it were me, I would be in Maryland every chance I could get. True competitors will only want to play the best. You guys can go to your LaxFest, Hofstra B/G, etc.... I would rather plays Loonies, Annapolis Hawks, Zingos, Greene Turtles, Prime-Time, , NOVU, Yorktown, Cross River.... Teams we haven't seen or beat yet. It doesn't make sense to keep seeing the same Long Island teams every week.... It gets boring!!!!! Must be boring for you guys as well! This is not personal, it's about making the boys better. I do commend Express for getting involved in the NYPLL... You probably aren't familiar with that.

once again avoiding the facts! Are those the tournaments your star players are playing with their more committed #1 teams? there is plenty of talent and tournaments on L.I.(town or travel) But you cant participate in those because your star players are playing with their #1 committed teams.How do you explain to the parents why you are not participating in the local tournaments? Do you think that is really fair to avoid certain tournaments because there is a possibility of a conflict that your team will play another team that your players play for?

It's funny but I can actually understand all that, weird, and you are correct, conflicts......that is why if you commit to playing for a team, that team should be your number one priority. Some people/players want it all, thinking there is always a better opportunity. Yes, as a parent, I would be embarrassed if my opposition was the team that I ditched. Loyalty, honesty, morals, values, good sportsmanship, isn't this what we are trying to teach these young men.

you would hope so! its really unfair to the rest of the kids and their families! pathetic!A true team is one that is loyal and committed to each other! Its real SAD!and unfair to the kids!!I cant believe they (coaches)allow this!

Agreed, a true team player it seems is hard to come by these days!!!! See you out on the field my friend.

I'm not avoiding anything. It goes back to been there and done that... One local tournament a year is good. Big picture is, you want to see the best everywhere. If you continue to play the same local teams is it helping both teams, or the one that is not as good? I guess we will continue to disagree on this point. Notice, my point is about the "team" and not as you put it, "star players". As I said, focus on your son's team, I'm quite sure our directors would love to scrimmage you!!!!

in 5th grade people were tellng me my kid is a can't miss off the charts middie. guess what he is the same size in 7th grade and pkaying goalie. calm dowm and enjoy it year to year.

Parents who have children with a true passion for lacrosse often find it hard to get them enough good lacrosse to play. How is it anyone's business? My son has played on multiple teams during a travel season. One of the teams was always his first team, and the other team knew from the start that when a conflict arose, he would be playing with his first team. I have seen the Dune Dawgs play, and can say one thing for certain, they are a strong team loaded with talent. A player or two does not make or brake a team. As a team I would hope the coaches/organization find the players the very best competition to play against, it's not about playing the same old teams beating them over and over just so you can gloat, it's about building skills for the players and raising their game. After all..isn't this about the players not the coaches or parents egos?

you are right! the more the better and especially if the child really enjoys it! but unfortunately there are parents out there that allow their child to play down to get extra lacrosse!i really dont see any positive impact this can have? it only holds back their child and really doesnt challenge them! it is also hurtful to the other children they play, especially those just starting out.I'm just an over concerned mom who wants whats best for all the kids, because thats what they are 'KIDS'

I THINK THE HAVOC DUNE DOGS ARE THE BIGGEST JOKE OUT THERE. TOTALLY UNORGANIZED AND CLEARLY THE ENTIRE PROGRAM IS CATERED TOWARD "THE SPECIAL 5TH GRADE TEAM". WHAT A JOKE. AND THE LOGO SUCKS.

Please don't hold back, tell us you really feel.

Everyone has a right to their opinion. Like they say, we all have them, amongst other things....:) As for your other comments, if so organized, I already have my tournament schedule and practice times for each week during the summer. Do you have that from your son's team? As for catering, once again, I suggest you attend the clinics. All teams going throughout the day on Saturdays.... Your comment regarding the logo clearly shows your maturity. I WOULD HOPE YOU ARE A KID, BECAUSE IT WOULD BE A SHAME FOR A PARENT TO ACT THIS WAY...

Really, If the organization is so unorganized why do we have our summer schedule already and when we practice. I guess your a little jealous and fearful of our SPECIAL 5TH GRADE TEAM

Whateva you are jealous of the team and sorry your not part of it

Dune dogs will fold once the parents see that you arranged your schedule and cater around 2 players who play for a more legit organization that doesn't charge for practices! How can you do this to the players and parents? False statement you ask?? Compare 91 to Dune dogs schedule??hmmm not doing the same tournaments?? Thats funny..

You can only hope! Maybe the team that you are associated with will then have a chance. The Dune Dawgs played local last year besides Vermont. They played in Rockstar this winter. Does it make sense to then play in local tourneys to see the same teams again? It's not funny, it's about challenging the kids. I've said once before, have your director call our director and schedule a scrimmage if this is such a problem for you. Good luck on your season!

As for saying one organization is more legit than another, people probably felt the same way when 91 was started. Several years later, they are deemed legit. Same thing will happen here. There is room for everyone here. As for a charge for practices, what facility is going to be available fo rfree during the winter? Believe me, another organization does the same thing. You must be new to the Long Island lacrosse scene.

Still avoiding the facts about how you schedule your tournaments around other organizations!! lol, your program will never compare to 91! good luck in your season as well!

Clearly, most of you posting stuff about this organization are uninformed or just broken hearted.

I especially love the comments about scheduling for 2 players and the references to 91 as if they were the foundation of that organization- wow where would 91 be with out them.

Oh - I know - they would be Express

Anyone posting that has no clue what they are talking about.

Its youth lacrosse - get a grip and enjoy your summer!

Replayed from the Shamrock Shootout Tournament Thread - Placing Discussion in the Age Group Thread

DUNE DAWGS are here to stay!!!!!!! Our 2019 team won the championship over 91 orange!!! It was a well played game by both sides but the DUNE DAWGS came out on TOP!! When you put the kids 1st with excellent coaching, this is the result!! We don't strive to be the BIGGEST travel team out there, just 1 that keeps the kids 1ST!!!!!! CONGRATS TO DUNE DAWGS 2019 and here's to a great season!!!!!

Does tis age group really need a thread? What a waste of time!

Yes and what about the 2021 teams, how can we leave them out?

Yes, the age group needs a thread on its own as the discussion of these teams started some time back and information was leaking into other age group threads.

If there is demand, we will include this age group on its own thread. Remember that there are organized tournaments for the 2021 (U/9) age groups right here on Long Island.

who are the stronger 2019 teams. not neccesary to rank them just who seems to have the early edge.

town then travel

who are the stronger 2020 teams. not neccesary to rank them just who seems to have the early edge.

town then travel

2019 Ranking
1. Dune Dawgs
2. Express Orange
3. 91 Orange
4. Gladiators
5. True Blue
6. Outlaws

No need for ranking - How about the towns?

If you have a pulse on Travel you should have a pulse on Town.

As a prior post noted on one of these blogs.

Local Colleges withcommunity affairs - with no affiliation to Express, 91, Gladiators etc. (sorry SB or Hofstra no affiliations)

Please set up a tourny (or 2) and reap the benefits of the profits so noone can say one is squewing the schedule. This way we find out who is best of class!


I am sure all of your schedules have space for this!!!

Have any of these teams played each other to know why it is ranked this way.

Stampede had a scrimmage with Jesters this evening. Jesters are a great team and look forward to seeing them play during the summer tournaments.

What is going on with Dune Dawgs?

I am only asking these questions because there are some boys in my town interested in playing. These are boys/parents that did not understand the "urgency" of trying out back in Sept, and i want to help the parents (my friends) because I have been asked what they should do.

As i am sure i will get the good, the bad, the ugly, but that is ok. Brign it on. I'd rather that than the Roses id be given by organizers (and I understadn that).

Do they have a make up try out this Sunday or are they just looking for a middie.

Or both

they are looking for a middie for their "A" team (is that blue or green)

and the try out is for the "B" team (is that blue or green)

Also a post (on the tryout blog) stated they never planned on playing spring, yet they won Shamrock. Were they a late entry to that or was it planned?

I lso hear there are boys who played for DD in the winter and play on other teams in the spring summer. That being the case, if they wanted to play a game or two in Spring/summer (if their teams are not playing) will they take minutes away from these new boys.

Dune Dawgs merged with Havoc to try and reach more kids. My son is not part of their organization but has played with a few of the kids from the 5th grade Dune Dawgs in previous winter sessions at Sports Arena as well as some clinics. These are a good group of kids and parents, and I can only see this organization getting better.

Did DD find what they were looking for?

what towns are these teams affiliated with if any?

this is not an easy question. Now a days you can play lax all year. They have indoor winter leagues, they have summer leagues. there are Tournaments all over most of the year. So you get a few kids who play Spring town lax, summer Tourneys on travel but then they play football in the fall. Most travel teams have a set amount of tournaments you pay for that include a set number of practices. Then they will have additional non mandatory stuff, clinics , winter league etc. If you dont play with them all year playing time probably depends on your coach, some will be fine with it, some will not. ALso depends how good the player is to be honest. The Dune Dawgs has fall clinics at Dowling, played some indoor league stuff, then had indoor clinics out east. They played on early tournament. YOu have to remember that the Dowling staff is the Havoc Dawgs staff, so when Dowling is in season they are MIA. I think some of the Dawgs played in a Friday night league this spring but not all. Remember, while a team may get 20 kids for the summer if 8 of those kids dont want to play winter then that team wont be playing games in the winter. So far my experience is that playing time in this club is pretty well spread out. Taylor states its a developmental league with winning being a low priority. I can tell you this, my son is an okay player, the coaches always spent a good amount of time with him and made sure he was getting playing time and that he was part of the offense. They also will not allow parents to be Head coaches

Anybody know anything about the True Blue 5th grade teams?

They have a few boys that have migrated with their dads (coaches) from jesters to 91 to now TB.

Is that a good a thing? Are there any new kids on those teams

I know those boys are very good (TR at least)

5th grade TB is good but not outstanding. Some town teams still give them tough games.

There are 2 5th grade TB teams, one is the "A" team coached by a couple of fathers and you know how that is their kids can do no wrong. The other is the "B" team coached by the program director CR and assisted by some young kid who was a big time player in collage not sure where or his name

Is tb like dd with borrowed players.

by borrowed do you mean players who LEFT other teams?

No no left play when needed or asked

TB, CR, TR, any other codes we need?

CR is the director of the program his brother is the 5th grade coach, good player in HS and in College,the assistents name is Wes played at Suny Farmingdale

Two Great Guys! Kids really like these guy's

Do you mean CR & his brother coach the "B" team for TB? What is the brothers name?

Why not email the organization and obtain the correct info instead of all this nonsense!!!!!! Geez!!!

CR is the director/owner of TB he does not coach. I believe his brother's name is Paul could be wrong, he coaches the "B"team. They have 2 teams in the age group because they did not want to turn players who wanted to be part of the program away. Now before everyone starts saying "see its about making money" the fee is about $600 which is almost 1/3rd what the other programs charge, he can't be turning a profit even if he wanted to.

Paul and Wes great guys, Great Organization!

Great job by the 2 5th grade teams from True Blue this weekend. The A team went south and lost a 9 to 8 heartbreaker in the finals and the B team finished 3rd in the fl$ losing only to the 2 finalists. Super job by players and coaches.

The true blue team that was at fl$ is not very strong. Only have about 7 middies and most of their goals are scored by the lefty attackman, shut him down and they are in trouble.

All that and they still came in 3rd.

Whats next someone will comment on the talent pool in Del. for the A team

Who cares, good job

BTG

Was this a back handed compliment or an all out dig to the other teams.

If they are not so good but still came in 3rd
who did they lose to (finalist and champs) not bad in my eyes.
who did they beat (those you just insulted).

Congrats to the 2019 Dune Dawg Green team on their runner-up peformance at the Summer Exposure tournament in Maryland. Boys played well against some tough competition.

OMG to bad the coaches of the teams didn't have you as an assistant, so simple stop on player. Maybe they tried and could'nt or someone else picked it up. By the way no attackmen from TB was picked for the All Star team, so must be your an expert and the people picking the team aren't.

All Star team at fl$ is a farce.

Agree 100% in the 5th grade group fl$ was 0 and 3 on saturday and had the most players picked for the All Star team

who won the fifth grade? what team had the all stars?

Jesters

I think that every team is good in their own way and it lets the kids have a lot of fun and play together at practice when they have practice and at games too! LOL

Congratulationg to the 5th grade Gladiators for going 3-0 in the Jay Gallagher Tournament.

Not a dig curious, were they by far the best 2019 team there? Who did they play? Who else showed up to play?

Who else went 3-0?

Have 91 Crush 4th grade play them or 91 Orange 5th played them?

Saw Gladiators play Express at Forsbergh, they looked good then I heard the score was one sided at the end.

Congrats to HDD LAX 2019 Green - Maverick Champs

Does anyone know if the dune dogs played the Patriots from N.J. in yesterday's tournament ?

They did not.

Even if we did, they would not have stopped us. These boys are good!

Really???

what was there record yesterday- HDD LAX went 4-0

Dune Dawgs will play the Patriots this upcoming weekend at the Madlax Capital Classic.

Woof ! Woof !

Let me give you the facts, and you decide...

Havoc Dune Dawgs is an organization dedicated to the game of lacrosse and the players who play it.

They DO NOT utilize "parent" coaches as HEAD Coaches, EXCEPT when that coach has COLLEGE Coaching experience. I am not just talking about Mike Taylor, who has an extremely impressive resume in addition to being a Division II NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP Coach. Coaching staff includes the players of Dowling Lacrosse, who are passionate and dedicated to teaching these players, and are about BOTH skill development and team cohesiveness.

This is NOT a "developmental" program as people have said. That said, they are COMMITTED to skill development. Without good skills, and constant refinement of skills, players become stagnant.

They are NOT about their own egos, they are about the players!

Currently The Havoc Dune Dawgs have 12 teams, Grades 3 - 11. Tryouts are in September, just like all the OTHER travel programs. Come down to the tryouts, you'll see what they're about. For tryouts they run an hour and a half clinic with players rotating through skill drills. They have the coaches evaluate the players. It's a very fair tryout.

Can boys play on the DD for the Winter and another team fo rthe Summer?

Sure. Just need to pay up.

Do they have games or scrimmages at the tryouts? Is it only an hour and a half?
How much do they charge?

No they can not. Access to Havoc Dune Dawgs team ONLY events require you joining a team. When they offer OPEN clinics then of course anyone can participate. As I suggested, if you want TRUE and ACCURATE information, contact them directly.

Inaccurate information! Get your facts straight.

You seem to be very well informed about the inner workings of the organization so perhaps you can answer this for me. Who let the dogs out ?

Hahaha....First of all it's Who let the DAWGS out?

lol...we hear that a lot. If you really want to know more, talk to people who are experiencing the organization first hand.

What we love about having our son involved is direct access to the "owners", they are a great group and are very fast to respond to our needs or questions.

So far it has been great, my son is happy and we are too!

ever talk to those not a part of it any more... but was with them at one time. every story has various endings depending on who is telling it. truth always lies somewhere inbetween

That's kind of impossible if tou're referring to Havoc Dune Dawgs. Thet're new this year. Two organizations merging, means NEW things not OLD.

You are correct, truth does lie somewhere in between. Between you and your child. I look at all these posts on here, 91, Express, and really just shake my head. At the end of the day people, get out in the yard with your child, practice on his or her weakness, practice on his or her strength, and just PRACTICE. Whatever team you are on will only enhance what your child brings to the table. I never feel comfortable bringing a child's ability into any of my posts; however, it just needs to be said to bring you parents back to earth.

You have to look at your child's abililty objectively, not as a parent. My boys play both basketball and lacrosse. As a parent I realize that their abilities in basketball just aren't there. Actually, one sons lacrosse skills aren't up to where they need to be as well. That's because he doesn't put the work in on his own. I told him he cannot expect to show up to the field and expect "IT" to happen without putting any work in on his own. I've coached both of my boys in travel basketball, and neither started. One actually asked me, "Am I starting?" I simply said to him, "Do you deserve to start?" My point is, even though they are my boys, for the good of the team, their time was limited. It had to be EARNED....

My point is people, realize your child's abilities, recognize their strengths and weakness, and work on them on your own. Whether that be a private lesson, group clinics, or you as a parent out in the yard with them. You cannot expect it to just happen because you paid, $1000 - $1,800 to be part of a team.

I read these posts, and I realize that most of you are living your youth through your children. Have realistic expectations and goals.

You are 100% wrong, that the truth only lies between you and your child, you are probably one of those dads that only took select kids to a tryout (and knew they would never make the team) and is never outside with your own son/s yet boasts about being a coach but in reality left the team/s behind because you dont like one thing or another.

You are also proably that coach/dad that insists your son drive through (not past) 3 defenders when there are 2 open players ahead of him or in the alley.

As a parent (consumer) you need to find out about these programs, these coaches, the people affilated with the program (past present and future) are/were like to make the best informed descion for your child and family.


And your are also incorrect to say whichever team your son is on will enhance his game, obviously you havent seen some of these teams!!! Not any team, just the right team with the right coaches for the child. I have seen some team that might set back a player or two!!

Wonder how many people read this thinking if it about them...

I can think of a few

This response to the previous post is exactly what's wrong with youth lacrosse. The previous post was well written and made some great points. This response is immature and argumentative. Why not try to get your point across withoutsounding so ignorant.

Let's start with your last point. I should have stated that whatever team your son plays for SHOULD enhance their skill. Getting on here trying to figure it out is the wrong way. For the most part, you will only see negative stuff on here, or people with an agenda against an organization. As for watching other organizations, I wouldn't waste my time because I feel I'm with best coach/organization for my son. I would think you did your due diligence beforehand, and hopefully from an objective standpoint. Let me spell this out for you, "what is best for your child". Also, make sure your child is doing his part in an effort to help the team. I was part of one of the "best organizations" out there last year. I have nothing negative to say about them; however, in an effort to raise the level of my sons game I felt it necessary to move elsewhere in order to get him to that next level. I didn't come on here asking others for their thoughts. Once the summer ended, I sat back and did the due diligence on my own. You know your sons skills, strengths, and weakness. Find the appropriate coach/organization that will work on them.

As for your other points, you clearly didn't understand what I was saying. I will not spell those out for you. Read them again, hopefully your comprehension skills will kick in.

In my effort to raise my son's level of play, I have to cut this short. Getting on the road to MD for a tourney this weekend.

Have a great weekend my friend!!!!

I just realized I wasn't signed in. I'm laxdad#14 just to be clear.

completely agree

I agree complety with your points safe travels. Sometimes take things to literal, because I have met to many people who have made it that way. Good luck this weekend.

Wasnt attacking you personally but those that preach and do not lift a finger. You know there are many out there.

I do enjoy and respect your posts. thank you.

NP.....Good luck to you and your son's team.....

Good idea! Does Stony Brook have an affiliation with any of the teams listed in the "top 5"? I just assumed all the top teams in the 2019 bracket would get into the Stony Brook Lax Clash. Think about it. It's the last tournament of the year. Every team would have had the whole summer to travel and play against competition from the other hotbed areas. Assuming that each team should be reaching their max potentional for the season, it should have been a no brainer for all organizations to enter. I just checked the website, and it seems one or two of the "top" programs didn't register. This could have really been the tournament of the year for the "top" Long Island teams.....Any thoughts???

The only issue is which team will your two best players play for

It's not an issue with me. They are very good players and they like to play their grade as well as the fifth grade. They did it in the shamrock as well. It didn't affect us one bit. It shouldn't be an issue with you. Might actually be better for you since you put it that way. I was not trying to be sarcastic, but it just seems that we really deal with some ignorant people up here. Never a quality discussion....

WHICH 2 PLAYERS ARE YOU REFERRING TOO. THERE ARE ALOT OF PLYERS ON THE TEAM THAT ARE JUST AS GOOD OR BETTER THAN THE OTHER

I agree!!!!

Hello who's affiliated with stony brook. Come on, you know, and if you don't you do not know much bout the 19/20 group

I understand he is affiliated with the girls. Keep in mind he is 2020, I'm talking about 2019. Not concerned about 2020. This post started with a discussion about the 2019 teams playing one another.

Being that you are only allowed to play on one roster per tournament which team will they play for??? If they chose 91, then will you still want to play those other four teams???

That's what competition is about, correct? With or without full rosters, I wouldn't have a problem playing any of those four other teams..... Where I come from, you play with whatever you have. No running or ducking from anyone. Just like, no anonymous tags on here. As I've always said, man up!!!! If you lose, you lose! Keep in mind, my suggestions were only to satisfy some of the others up here posting about how the teams were ranked. I will never boast or brag about the team my son plays for. I just thought it would be great for all the top programs to play in this tournament. End of the season, everyone should be at the top of their games. From the looks of the way the DD's, 91, and Express have played in their respective tournaments, it seems that the best competition is right here on the Island for this class.

Actually he is a 2022 lol.. Pretty pretty good

Does anyone have any info on this 3rd grade team from Franklin Square I have been seeing them everywhere ? Where is Franklin Square ?

Any word on the schedule for Stony Brook Lax Clash

I saw the 5th going into 6th grade Gladiators team playing in Stony Brook. They looked good, but was told that the coaches had a falling out and there will not be a Gladiator team for this grade next year. It is a shame because my son was considering trying out for them. Can anyone verify if this is true?

Follow our website gladiatorslacrosse.com or use the link on the side bar here this website. Information will be coming out in a few weeks.

Have been checking the website and there is no information. Tryouts are almost here and everyone has advertised.

anybody know when havoc dune dogs tryouts are

365 LAX - Save your money and time.

I'm guessing you didnt have a good experince? Correct?
can you give us a little more color on 365 lax?

Gladiator coaches had a falling out because of the head coach. The entire team left! What does that tell you? He causes problems everywhere he goes. He has never even played lacrosse. He puts on a good front but everyone figures him after they commit and hand over their money. He will lie and cheat.

Actually I was part of that team and it was a better experience once the two so-called assistant coaches quit on the boys in mid season.

No matter how you feel about the team and the coaching, please have some dignity and class and stop the personal attacks. Show your bad or good feelings about the team by staying with the program or moving on.

My son played on the Gladiators and it was good lacrosse. We paid $500 for 6 summer tournaments. We won one and were in the championship games in a couple more.

Anyone playing fallball? Where, with whom?

oh

The assistant coaches for the Gladiators did not quit. They were forced out by the head coach. His only agenda was to get maximum playing time for his son and the remaining assistant coaches son. 17 out of 20 kids left the team. What more information do you need to know. Rumor has it this head coach had issues with Smithtown lax as well.

That's correct. That coach is no longer allowed to coach in Smithtown.

It is a shame they were a good team!

Why cant we all just get along. I cant believe 3 or 4 of the top suffolk town teams fell apart this year.

For this age group I wish someone would Help PAL coordiante
the following teams to play a 10 week schedule. 7 weeks season 3 week playoffs


Smithtown
3V
West Islip
Bayshore
Commack
Mt Sinai
East Islip, Hauppauge, Connetiquot

My son is playing current 5th grade fall lax with the Jesters. Any one know of any other teams playing fall?

Amazing that it was only $500 for 6 tournaments. I saw them they looked good and well coached and seemed to play the best teams in the A division.

Please stop. The seaon is over. Both sides grow up and ignore the idiocy.

Each town has there issues, make up for the betterment of the kids.


One quetion is team smithtown for the entire Smithtown township or just the Smithtown east or Snmithtown west schools.

You get what you pay for. I played for the Gladiators last year and I would not play again for the two remaining coaches if it were free.

Maybe the coaches should have stopped the idiocy of running a dictatorship and grossly favoring their kids!

Wait did the 2017 Gladiators break up?
Where are they going?

witness a mom (of gladiators 2019 after a game at forsberg) make her son go over to talk to the coach and ask why he only played 2 minutes.

I saw the emmbarressment on the boys face and felt bad for him.

Not sure if i agree at what/how it was done but sounds like there was a lot of those situations.

2017 gladiators are together. 2019 gladiators fell apart to say the least. Different coaches

No this whole thread refers to the 2019 team and some unhappy campers. The 2017 is still together and there were no such problems as this.

The 2019 Gladiators team had amazing talent amongst all their players. It definitely was a shame the coaches only saw what their own sons did and played them in multiple positions so they could play the whole game. With different coaching that team would have been just as good as the 2017 team.

this from one of the coaches that left.....please move on, the past is in the past. truly would appreciate it. thank you

I AM ONE OF THE FORMER COACHES OF THE 2019 GLADIATORS. NONE OF THE COMMENTS ON THIS OR ANY SITE IS FROM A FORMER COACH. ALL OF OUR TALKING WILL BE ON THE FIELD! YOU HAVE MY NUMBER LET ME KNOW IF YOU GET A TEAM TOGETHER AND WANT TO PLAY. EDDIE

Where did you go, another program or starting your own? Did the team go with you?

Eddie I am not a gladiator parent but did you guys break up. you say you will do your talking on the field. So is it only kings park on the gladiators now since Smithtown is upset with each other.

no disrespect meant - I thought you guys were one of the best teams we faced. thsi lax scene is crazy, please do whats best for the boys past present and future.

I had told some of our town boys to look into your tryouts.. let it be known what the future plans are.

The kids are playing. Not you Eddie..Its youth lacrosse not the UFC. No wonder you weren't welcomed back..

Eddie went his way but the team will move on. More than a few roster spots open. Tryouts soon.

The problem with anonymous posting is the reader assumes they know who's posting. I've read everything and it is fairly obvious that's what is happening here. There are parents in every thread, posting as if they are only a bystander and even coaches who post compliments to themselves. This thread obviously has very disappointed parents in the experience for their sons. Don't assume you know who is posting. I'm sure we would all be surprised if we knew who really posted some of the comments, the good and the bad!

I was told that there were only 2(coaches sons) players who stayed to play for the Gladiators. ALL the other players left, from all towns. That being said, there are obviously many spots open on the Gladiator team roster. I wouldn't do it after reading about the head coach, but if you are still interested, I'm sure they will have tryouts soon.

TRYOUTS ANNOUNCED. 9/29 - GLADIATOR WEBSITE HAS INFO

That is insane! I hope they are actually hiring coaches this year. Two years in a row the head coach's teams have broken up. Who knows, maybe third time is a charm?

Which town has the biggest participation in the 2019 yr.

BOTC is about to start rolling forward to the new seasonal year. Be sure to check out the Boys 2019 and new Boys 2020 Fall 2012/Spring 2013 thread, our first threads for the new season.

Anyone hear how 2019 express is looking?

They should be very good. Kept the core from last year and picked up 5 or 6 Nassau County boys. 91 2019 also added some very good players.

The defense seems a little weak though they should have picked up some new defenders. Should be ok though.

Will 91 or Express play each other this fall? Have either practiced yet this fall to see how the new parts gel?

Any news boys with frequent flyer miles?

Which teams are you talking about 91 or Express?

Express

Express 2019 "D" looks good, lost two players but the the two kids they picked up are solid. Overall, 2019 express is much stronger at every position. Should be a good year.

Hope the 2019 express team got better this year becuase last year they stunk. What did they win one tournament. Very easy to improve when you were not good the year before...Right?

If you call losing 3 games from Sept 11 to July 12 "Stunk" ok

You are very well-informed. That team lost two games in their age group in over 60 games played last year. I guess losing only twice to top (AA) teams in two tournament championship finals makes them a lousy team.

I have to agree with the brillant post above. They lost to Team 91 in the finals of Tristate and to a AA team from PA in the finals of the Patriot games. Other than that the team was undefeated all summer and didn't lose once in their age bracket since last september. They were awful!!

Losing to 91 must of killed you since you don't support any tournaments from 91. . Most of the wins were against b teams anyway. When u played the real teams you lost or you called it an exhibition game. Stop kidding yourself most of the the team is three village players and your best player from hills sat the bench for the other kids. That is why you lost.

Most of the tournaments you entered were garbage beside trilax which you lost. The others were not real tournaments.

Now if you're not from 91 2019 Orange or STEPS 2018 you have no idea what your talking about, those boys were a very talented unselfish team.

Sure, Express 2019 Orange played two bad games last summer. The finals @ tristate and a game verses 2018 STEPS. As they may have never reached their full potential (and yes the philosophy did not include set plays to maximize certain skill sets ), but (Outside of the 2 games noted above) they never "STUNK" .

Lets see what this year brings, lots of new helmets along with a new name, but make no mistake there will never be another Express 2019 Orange like last year!

think what you want but:

I am quite sure the teams in summer sizzle and patriot games qualify as better than "B".

As far as Losses:
I doubt any team (2018 or 2019) on LI would have run with 2018 Steps on that day.

Did any 2019 team play 2018 Laxachusettes? Sure it was an exhibition scrimmage, after an exhibition against 2019 Laxachusettes where Express won with class.

The 91 game, yep they man handled us early, it happens, but we will meet again.

Those 3v players (3 of 5) are the tops in their positions in 2019 regardless the team they are on or the helmets they wear. (1D 1M 1A)

I dont remember any top player sitting the bench in a game we lost, instead I recall not resting those players enough or playing them out of position!!!

Team 91 which is a team I respect (and the series is even at 1 & 1). Other than 91 name a team that the 2019 team lost to. There were no exhibition games. The team doesn't go out of its way to avoid 91 supported tournaments. The kids play where they are told to play. Take it up with the directors. Also 5 players from one town on a team of 22 is not most. Get a clue and stop hating. What is your gripe with the team anyway?

I don't know where you got your info from but it is incorrect. There werev5 out of 22 three vill kids last year. The hills kid never sat the bench for anyone. He is the best player on the island at his age group. And no I'm not his Father.

I saw better defenseman at the tryouts and they are not on our team so when they say they kept the core group together I hope that it works this season. I hope the favors to keep these kids together pays off for the summer

Open your eyes, going in they were looking for poles, if you are so close you know 2 didnt return to tryout from last year and 2 of the poles that did return are the best at the grade (one of them maybe considered a LSM). But the most important of all and core to the returning defense are the two goalies.

Truth be told, those who did not return be it by choice or not will be missed. but if favors were granted the players who received the benefit are very good players. So I am not sure if that qualifies as a "Favor".

Of course they won't replace the defenseman with better ones. Because where will the coaches son play? Just saying sometimes even if your a coach and your son is on the team you may have to face the truth and move on to another team or realize that your son is on the team because of who you know. I am sure the other parents who are paying 2400 would rather have a different defenseman on that team then the coaches kid. Hope it doesn't hurt you that much you can only hide a kid for so long.

Gentlemen and Ladies it is September and everyone is getting all worked up. I think its a bit of a stretch stating that The Express 2019 team was lousy. Yes I would say that we ( yes my son plays on the team) would have liked to have won the two finals that we lost but it didn't happen. That being said we are looking forward to another summer season. We have added eight new players so it should be fun to watch. Jimmy M who is a super guy and I have a great deal of respect for did a great job shutting off the kid from the hills in the finals. I wish those involved would check their ego's at the door and let 91 and Express meet more than once a year. This would benefit the most important people........Our son's. Best of luck to all this season. No hate here just enjoy watching the game played at the highest level no matter what uniform you wear

very well said. I'm not sure why all the anger towards 11yr olds. If your son didn't make the team this year or was unfortunately cut from last year's team, there are plently of other great programs to join on Long Island. Saying a group of 10yr olds "stunk" or attacking coaches who by all accounts are very fair and positive is not very constructive. If your definition of success is how many tournament medals 6th grade boys collect during the summer, you have a lot to learn about youth sports.

Couldn't agree more. Parents need to simmer down. It is a long way to go before college recruiting. Relax or you might burn yourselves out.

Like Facebook, I wish there was a like button on here. Sometimes you can't add more value to a statement and just want to whole heartedly agree. If your we're ever a part of this team you would agree too.

Good luck to you guys & all 2019. The better the grade becomes the better all of the players become.

Mr. Wolf

Mr Wolf like my email said you are a class act. Thanks again My Best Ticket man

ok 2019 who is or where are NY ALL Grey???

a 91 post states a bunch who used to be Gladiators mixed with some huntington boys.

Sorry, they are not the best long poles in the grade - very good players but your statement is an over-reach. D was not their problem last year anyway, O was.

Tough to say who is "tops" at any position at this age, dont get carried away. Why are you letting this 91 kid get your goat anyway? Its so obvious. BTW, be careful about saying which players from one town were better than others from the same. A lot of people read these posts and it is wrong to single out 11 year olds on a forum. I'm sure the other two 3V parents would argue with your evaluation since most Express parents from last year's team reading this forum know which team the other long pole is now playing for. Not an easy team to make for a kid who is not "tops" as you say.

"Those 3v players (3 of 5) are the tops in their positions in 2019 regardless the team they are on or the helmets they wear. (1D 1M 1A)"

Really? They are 11 and 12 year olds. Did you see every kid at this age group play to make a far-flung statement like this? Kind of throwing the other two kids under the bus too..eh? Nice, and you are probably a coach or a friend - or both. I hope the kids dont read this stuff. I guess these kids were cut this year right? Ignoramus

pretty funny who ever you are so one of the boys you offend is a coaches kid. One of the kids who left made a very good orange team along with another very strong 3v kid . dont forget the 2 new 3V kids on the team both very strong players as well . And yes they are 11 years old wait until they Hit puberty it all changes . print this, store it away and ask yourself the same quesrtion in 3-4 years

Exactly, and that is my point. The original post was rediculous and anyone with sense knows that any Express Orange team is not lousy, didn't play B teams, as a matter of fact they played more up than at their level; and only 5 kids were from the same town. The "3 out of 5" counter point was a backhanded insult to certain kids for dubious reasons. The point could have easily been made by simply saying "only 5 of 22 kids were from the same town and all deserved to be on the team last year as do all of the kids from that same town this year". Thats it. C'mon, you are debating with a kid for Pete's sake and insulting individual kids from your own team (yes including one of the coaches' sons) in the process! The worst of it is that I strongly suspect the post was submitted by someone who is more than just a parent - if you get my drift. Who else would have a ready-made post season analysis like that one other than a coach or a seriously disturbed parent? Look, lets not start calling out individual kids until they can shave at least, ok? Lets not anoint certain kids as underarmour all-americans yet. Like you said, there are a lot of miles between today and the point when you can strut around town saying "My kid just made a verbal commitment to...." Slow your roll and just enjoy the fact that your kid is healthy and can play at this level -for now. Good Luck.

As you noted it was rediculous to respond, yet you responded, and so am I, although I too think it rediculous. So lets stop the bull, first off regardless if A B C everybody has a post season analysis. Crazied parent, level headed parent, player, rival or coach. As well, anyone who is playing on these top teams, as the top players, has aspirations of continueing to be the tops (god willing).

I am quite sure the comment made about the players was not a back handed slap to anyone. Just making the point 3V has very good players. Those who were involved, played against, as well as, the coaches know they were all a valuable part of the team.

However, I see no wrong pointing out a few players as a positive. Give Kudos to those players and not just everybody.
Unfortunately on this site when you make note of a posotive it is taken as a bullseye (especially when it is a counter point. Side bar: notice how noone has said they wernt. Instead everyone felt a need to say stop insulting the others.) As far as insulting a coach's son, HOW, they are both probably thinking they were talking about their son. Stop it, it was a joke, they are level headed guys who probably dont care. By the way, in no way was it mentioned that one was tops and one was bottoms. NO, It was just highlighting those 3. So stop stirring the pot.

(as far as the other player who moved on, he moved on no need to mention him, outside of he is a great kid with a great family who looked for something different).

I read it over and over I am quite sure I will get blasted for this but there were no mal feelings intended. Except maybe to the person who they were responding to. There are plenty other posts to throw daggers at, not that one!!!

Now try playing 4 games against each other (1 fall, 1 spring, 2 summer) until that happens both teams are second best.

(oh, by the way, being second best is ok, it is not always about being #1)

ok, Im saying it - they weren't. Except maybe the middie

How about Havoc Dune Dawgs 2019?

How do they rate?

Dawgs are a great team - no question

OK, this is it for me and then I am done. You can rip me apart in perpetuity for all I care but I suggest you follow my lead and walk away. Drop this thing like a leaky bag of doggy-doo before other people figure out what I already know, and you compromise your "situation". Don't worry I won't "out" you, but just think twice next time before you get on here and give your subjective "buddy evaluations" for everyone to see. I know its hard but try to resist next time. If you know you put a target on a kids back when you single them out with compliments why did you do it? What do you think it does when you insult them; even by omission, in this case? Fully disclose who and what you are like the others in your "situation" next time you want to rate kids -or - just refrain altogether, which is my advice. You are a good guy and I wouldnt want to see you get hurt. I on the other hand, am not singling out and commenting on the talent level of individual kids, teams, organizations or coaches. Don't come on here buddy-bragging because you expose the kids to remarks they shouldn't be exposed to at 11 and remember, no one but you said they were, either). And no matter how cute you tried to get with your post yesterday afternoon, if people knew who made your "Top Player and best players at that age group" selection and who was saying it, they would be a little ticked-off and you and I know why. The others reading this dont get it but we do, don't we? And you and I both know why that was wrong to do (on multiple levels).
Parting remark - until certain players are TRUELY, OBJECTIVELY AND INDEPENDENTLY evaluated and placed, don't lecture me on how its ok to be #2!
P.S. Don't know where you are going with the two teams playing each other 4 times a year thing but you were responding to multiple posts so I will give you the benefit of the doubt. I'm done here

2019 DUNE DAWGS are the #1 team at their age group!

Have to say 91 Orange is tops in that grade. 28-0 last year

Says who? Have they played 91 or Express? Or are they avoiding them.

2019 Top 5

1- 91
2- Dune Dogs
3- Express
4- True Blue
5- Who Knows ??? I will give it to the Outlaws ( would have been Gladiators but they are no more )

Havoc Dune Dawgs beat 91 twice last year in StonyBrook!

I don't order of team is correct!

91 was 28-0 after they played a tough game against the dune dawgs in the championship game at stony brook last year....

Hopefully we all will play one another this year. Please understand that the DD's avoid no one......

Based upon last year I have to say your number 1&2 should switch. I've heard though that 91 has brought in some nice pieces this year. It should interesting and fun to watch it play out. As a poster said a few post back, it only helps all of our kids if the level across the board rises. Good luck to you all for the fall, and hopefully we can all be at just one tournament together next year.....

Even better how about all of these teams agree to play 2-3 times in 2013 early ,mid and late summer run it is a round robin tournament 1 day teams are pulled out of a hat as to draw all teams pay in and hire refs. And play some great lacrosse hear on long island and then afterwards when it's warm have a barbecue starting playing nicely in the sand box . No program makes any money off it and the kids get to play maybe even raise money for a good cause. All a novel idea. So who's. The program to say yes. I'm sure you can come up with some dates that work for all .

Hard to say who is better there were two kids who played for both organizations so who says where they play. My guess is express is the dark horse but they have the better goalie play and 91 may get caught up to because everyone is gunning for them. 3 coaches with 3 kids = a whole lot of politics.

The 2019 Gladiators are now the NY All Greys - Minus 2 or 3 kids and minus the parent coaches...

Last year there were 3 kids (not 2) that played for both 91 and Dune Dogs.

Great post. Between those LI teams , there's probably some of the best players on the East Coast. Why travel to MD and Conn to play their teams every weekend. There should be a LI tournament where the top travel teams must play in. Keep it here let the kids have fun vs the best. Half the boys on these different teams are friends already , whether it be town friends, some play against each other in other sports. They get along with each other. It's the parents who are the "haters". Let's grow up. This goes for the directors of these teams as well.

SPORTSMANSHIP! Sportsmanship! Sportsmanship! If the parents have it, the kids will too. The kids SHOULD all be friendly. They all enjoy the game, they all work hard at it, and without the helmets, they are all the same, just a bunch of young boys having fun.

After traveling from state to state I have to agree with you regarding the talent..

HAVOC DUNE DAWGS ARE IN!!!! AS MANY OF YOU ALREADY KNOW , MIKE SHOTTS FROM HAVOC DUNE DAWGS PASSED AWAY SUDDENLY IN LATE AUGUST. THE DIRECTORS OF THE HDD ARE PUTTTING TOGETHER A SCHOLARSHIP FUND IN THE MEMORY OF MIKE SHOTTS. MAYBE THIS ROUND ROBIN TOURNAMENT COULD BE THE FIRST OF MANY TO COME ,AND IT WILL BE FOR A GREAT CAUSE. I WILL BE REACHING OUT TO BOTH 91 AND EXPRESS DIRECTORS TO TRY AND START THE BALL ROLLING, AS WELL AS THE OUTLAWS,JESTERS,TRUEBLUE,ETC. WE'RE IN WHO ELSE IS? CONTACT ME DIRECTLY AT Phil.Polo@HavocDDLax.com. THE ABOVE IS JUST A SUGGESTION FOR A CAUSE, WE ARE OPEN TO OTHER IDEAS.

Regards,

Phil Polo
Director of Operations - Havoc Dune Dawgs

Are you talking about the parent coaches who stayed and worked with the kids when the going got tough or the coaches and parents who quit on the team ?

No need to take digs on this outstanding post. Keep it positive

I don't know why you think it's necessary to revisit this, but the parent coaches that stayed didn't want to make changes. The parent coaches and parents that left Gladiators all wanted the changes. The head coach didn't allow the assistant coaches to speak on the sidelines so what were they supposed to do? Of course, they stepped down but they did the right thing by their sons and the rest of the team and had their boys finish the season. No one is an evil person here. It doesn't make everyone bad people, it just means they wanted something different than the ones who stayed. Why is this so hard to understand? The All Greys have non-parent coaches who have no bias coming in and a great deal of experience. This doesn't have to be a continuous battle. We are all doing what we feel is best for our sons and it obviously is different things. It's not the end of the world, just the Gladiators. By the way, the little secret is that the parent coaches who "stayed" were asked to keep the team together this year and use these same non-parent coaches. They refused which is their prerogative. But please let go of hating the people that went in another direction. In the end, all these teams are about groups of boys who love to play lacrosse and are pretty good at it. They just want to play

Does anyone know how the All Greys did at the tournament last weekend. Thanks.

I saw them beat bayshore in their first game, didn't see the rest.

They lost to Crush and beat White 5-3 I believe. They looked good.

I was told that the Kings Park cosch was kicked off the board of football, kicked off of the Gladiators I understand because he wouldnt coach the boys and would just have a catch with his son on the sidelines during games. The Huntington coach left the Outlaws the year before saying many nasty things about that program and their Director and did the same thing the following year with the Gladiators. Some people dont change.

Nor do other people who listen to everything they "are told". There are always three sides to every story

Just for the record, the Kings Park coach is still on the football board. He is still volunteering his time as head coach for the football and lacrosse team as he has done for the last 10 years. Obviously the kids/parents who stayed with the two coaches know the truth!

Wow seems like the bitter Ex Gladiator coach lost his way and his team.

The Kings Park coaches and the coach from Huntington are new to the All Greys this year and had no association with any 2019 team last year. Can't just write anything.

I don't know the Kings Park coach, but I do know the Huntington coach, and he has done many good things for underprivileged children in this league. It seems to me that some have lost sight of what's most important...the children. Get rid of the chip on your shoulder, and let the kids play.

Our fifth graders "crushed them". I thought we would have a better game.

My sons team played them over the weekend and the Kings Park coach and Huntington coach from last year's Gladiator team are NOT coaching the NY All Greys. Their sons are players like all the other boys and the team has new coaches. As long as all our kids are having fun and learning on the field and off who really cares?

Sorry but as another 91 parent, truth be told I wouldn't say we crushed them. A couple of us through we should have beat them by more but it wasn't a "crush". We know what our usual scores go up to and we weren't even close to that. Give credit where credit is due.

"A couple of us through we should have beat them by more but it wasn't a "crush". We know what our usual scores go up to and we weren't even close to that" - Seriously buddy?? Do you realize how ridiculous you sound, referring to your 5th grader's team as 'we' and bragging about how you usually run up scores?? Without knowing it, you've summed up what everyone already thinks about your program.

"The Huntington coach left the Outlaws the year before saying many nasty things about that program and their Director."

My son plays on the Outlaws and I agree with the above statement. The PAL coach from Huntington talked many of the boys from the Outlaws into leaving 2 seasons ago and was still doing the same thing this years also. He has terrible things to say about the Outlaws and I wish he would just go away. He doesnt seem happy unless he does everything he can to deplete our team of players and have them play with his son. We find the Outlaws to be a very good organization and are happy with the coaching.

Are you kidding? Our team is 1-2 years younger than they are and we still beat them.

Outlaws are a second rate organization at 2019 level , my son was on that team from 2 years ago and I would stand by any negative comments made by the Huntington PAL coach.

I hope that the kids aren't reading these comments. As adults we should be setting an example. If we hide behind a computer screen instead of talking face to face, our children will follow. This forum should be about sportsmanship. When our children start bad-mouthing others, it is because they have learned it from their parents. Enough already.

I have a kid on 2019 outlaws Black and they are 2nd rate in no way. Coaches are outstanding, and team is very good. Sounds like sour grapes , I think that coach who left a few years back will never be happy.

It truly is a shame that people can try to hurt a person anonymously. Your note about the Huntington coach is off base. I have coached with him in multiple sports. My son was on that Outlaws team 2 years ago. That team was coached by a college kid. What was the "nasty" thing that he said? Something like "we spent a lot of money to be coached by a hungover college kid." I believe that the Outlaws changed their coaching policy after that year. Matter of fact, he was a fan of the director who trys hard, but didn't take his departure nor mine well. I am extremely close to him and I have only heard him say that both of his boys had a good experience in that organization. He is anything but a nasty guy. He is an involved and supportive parent and a loyal friend. Unfortunately, the original idea of him being "nasty" came from people whose actions have been appauling and well documented. Not agreeing does not make you "nasty." If we are going to beat up a guy for recruiting and wanting his son to play with good players, then we need to get upset at all of the "elite" teams because everyone recruits. Parents don't leave programs that they are happpy with so don't leave the Outlaws. I am upset with him because he didn't ask my son to play on his team, but I will settle that in person. Go after the bad guys and leave the the good guys alone--especially the guys that don't earn a dime from lacrosse, don't coach and are just parents .

91 takes a lot of heat for poor sportsmanship. the 2019 White team should be singled out for being a great group. Improving all the time without the nonsense. Great job coaches and parents!

Are they all 1 or 2 years younger; is that age or grade? We all know who is on that team.... Oh, maybe you are just talking about the half of the team that gets to watch..

We were watching the games because everyone wants to see and has heard about "Crush." That game was the closest they had all day...By no means was it a crush - it was nice to see a competitive game against them.
Also, all the behind-the-back shots were missed...Maybe they are losing their touch..

The 2019 white team should be singled out for poor sportsmanship, whether they're a great group of kids or not. They consistently enter B divisions, and blow teams out, without regard to sportsmanship. The parents and coaches get all excited and crazy, right down to the 10th goal, in a 10-1 game. It is a great group of kids, with what seems to be excellent coaching, but the parents and coaches should be ashamed of their behavior on game day.

Unless you're talking about tournaments in August, or in the fall, you're incorrect. My son played them twice, in B divisions, in July. At one of the tournaments, some of the kids and parents didn't know they were playing in B, so you might not have realized it. Hopefully, they'll play A next summer, and that great group of kids will be challenged more often. I'm sure the kids would enjoy that, but maybe not the parents.

The fact that you are back posting about the 2019 white team again is 2 things, 1 a litttle creepy that you still hold a grudge from last year and your weird obsession with them ISS frankly odd. But more importantly your post just won me five bucks, I bet that you would be back before first spring practice, and wow did you beat that. Thank you and bless your creepy little heart.

What are you talking about, "back" before spring? I was responding to someone's silly comment about how that team should be commended, and not singled out for poor sportsmanship. Whatever. Have fun beating up weaker teams.

I have found the Huntington PAL coach to also be unproffessional and callous. In conversation with others he has multiple times made negative reference to players on our PAL team where parents and many times players can hear him. He apparantly has one of the Huntington coaches who is now coaching the All Gray team that his son plays on. I guess he feels that it will help his sons playing time in high school.
Obviously the remarks that are admitted to in the prior email are an example of the negativity that is spewed from this person. If my son was a college kid who was trying his best to coach a team I don't think it would be fair to call him a hungover college kid. Just because you didnt take college seriously doesnt mean everyone else was drunk and not studying and trying to improve themselves. Is this is really how you want your son to behave when he attends college? Obviously your parents paid for your schooling and you did not take it seriously and did not care about the outcome.

Why let the facts get in the way of tearing someone down? There are no Huntington coaches coaching the team that you mention. You keep badgering someone from hearsay. No guts. We know who has the ax to grind. Embarrassing and immature.

Wow this is getting quite of hand. First the negative comments start about the team, then to the coach, and now to his son??????? Now it's getting scary. All emails are traceable....If I were advising him, I would advise him to consult an attorney.

Outlaws Black stand for " B " as in a B level team being promoted as an " A " caliber team so the Director can charge enormous fees. The Huntington PAL coach is a kind and reasonable man who just wants the best for his kid. My son does not play in Huntington or for All Grey but I have spoken with this man and he is reluctant to speak poorly about anyone. Last year at a tournament where Gladiators were outclassed and out coached , he was hoping the situation would get better but it sounds like it got
worse. As far as the drunk college student , I not know if that was the case but I can say first hand the person referred to was a nasty, immature young man who did not have the respect of 9/10 year old boys or their parents. The Director never addressed the issue until it was to late and the young coach left the organization for a GREENER DAWG House but by then it was a lost cause .

I have no dog in this fight, but run and get a lawyer over this? All that is wrong in this society rolled up into one internet post. I guess when your too old to run to mommy, the lawyers make bank. Reading your post made me ashamed to be part of this online forum...yuck.

Since this thread has been dealing with Fall 2011/Spring 2012 issues and carried across to the new season, BOTC is going to close this thread from further postings. Any age group specific issues can be picked up in the Boys 2019 Fall 2012/Spring 2013 or Boys 2020 Fall 2012/Spring 2013 discussions.