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I will periodically send these messages directly to US Lacrosse. They are interested in making changes and asked for feedback from its members. You will help effect that change that is needed.
Your input matters.
Remember, these posts will be forwarded and proper language is required.

Here's your chance to be heard and do more than just [lacrosse] and complain.
Post away!!!!!!!
No more stall. Please!
On the girls side, 4 or 5 fouls and you are out of the game (like basketball). Take the guess work out of the referees hands. 5 hacks and you're gone! When it's just a whistle the same girls hack over and over.

3 seconds should also go away as its called very inconsistenetly
Proof of age....Just like soccer. At least for 2nd-8th grades. And maybe implement a yellow/red card system for repeated roughness...
Sure Grade based or U based, either or works but if you go grade you have to attach a max age. Never should more then a two year diffremce occur in youth lax
Being through the youth frontier of lacrosse it seems at times it is the wild wild west. Being at a grade based tournament this past year, I was shocked to see the obvious blatant disregard for moral standards. I was at a grade based tournament and noted many DOB a year older than my son.

While playing a game a certain player made a good move against my sons team. The player was 19 months older than the player he made the move on. The sad part was a verbal exchanged ensued between the parents, something to the fact... "...if he was playing his right age/level he wouldn't have been able to accomplish that move..." only to have the retort. "... It isn't our fault you are to lazy or poor to reclass... everyone is doing it".

This is the sad state that reclassing has done. Gladwell states if one or two people do it, you have an advantage, when more than a few do it is there still an advantage... or does it create a bigger disadvantage.

Rob



The five foul rule for sure, to keep the game from getting too rough and for the same girls refrain from hacking.

Something has to be done about the stall, some sort of timer.

Proof of age. All other sports do it, lacrosse can too.
BRING BACK THE HORN!! For at least middle school and below. High School and club (all ages) I get it, but are we really trying to speed the game up in PAL or middle school?! Still trying to teach and get kids even time
Age rules set for all levels, similar to soccer.

Requirement for goalies to wear more protective gear elementary through middle school.

Smaller field and smaller goals for the younger kids (6 yet old goalie shouldn't be in full size goal).

Originally Posted by Anonymous
Proof of age....Just like soccer. At least for 2nd-8th grades. And maybe implement a yellow/red card system for repeated roughness...


Yes, this MUST be done for so many reasons:

Fairness (Frustrations are building and it is just terrible what is going on with kids showing up 2 years older than the others!)

Safety (Do we need to wait till a kid dies or is paralyzed after being hit by a kid 2 years older playing down?)

Growth of game (how do you expect to attract middle class kids when the wealthy have the reclass advantage?)

C'mon US Lacrosse, this issue needs immediate attention!! I am all for the soccer system with US Lacrosse issued picture ID cards, renewed each year. I'll also let you know a little secret. My sons have not been registered with US Lacrosse for two years. Yes tournament wavers ask for their number, I just make one up and nobody ever checks. This will be a way for you to make much more money because I know I don't only speak for myself.
Enforce like-age vs like-age competition, through the use of roster lists (which include names, uniform number, US lacrosse number, and date of birth), and photograph ID cards for each player. In order to be less disruptive to current teams, grandfather in 2025 and older, and only start it with 2026 and younger - although many will prefer that it be enforced immediately at all levels.

Further, what is lost often when age classification is discussed is the growth of the game. Lacrosse is growing, but would grow more significantly if age based enforcement at all levels (even Town) were implemented similar to other sports. Lack of structure in this area scares away the casual parent who may be wary about a sport they know little about and may see as violent. Youth lacrosse, and especially the summer and fall circuits, needs to do a better job including the more casual and/or less athletic player. It can't only be the bastion of the prospective college athletes. Especially in non-hot bed areas (where growth is needed), teams with wide variances in age are squaring off, which chases away many parents who frankly are not used to seeing this in soccer, hockey and baseball.
For the girls, definitely a shooting clock and a foul rule.
There should still be the flexibility to have U and grade based games. The U designation should be confined to a one year range; just stick to a universal 12 month DOB range (there will always be older and younger). Grade based should also have some age stipulation and allow for maybe an 18 month DOB range.

The original reason for a 2 year U span was to allow less developed areas to combine 2 grades and field teams. This policy has been manipulated and folks have worked the system to gain an advantage on the competitive side of the sport. The 2 year rule is a very good rule for a rec in-house league that has low enrollment and is developmental... but it losses its efficacy during competitive lacrosse.

If you are in 7th grade, but you're 18 months older than the youngest eligble player (you really should be in 8th grade)... you play up (simple). You can cause no undo harm to others, you need to prove yourself against your true peers.

Originally Posted by Anonymous
BRING BACK THE HORN!! For at least middle school and below. High School and club (all ages) I get it, but are we really trying to speed the game up in PAL or middle school?! Still trying to teach and get kids even time


Getting rid of the horn was the best thing ever. Is there a horn in youth hockey? No.

It's about kids running and changing on the fly. Horns almost killed the game.
More time in crease for goalie
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
BRING BACK THE HORN!! For at least middle school and below. High School and club (all ages) I get it, but are we really trying to speed the game up in PAL or middle school?! Still trying to teach and get kids even time


Getting rid of the horn was the best thing ever. Is there a horn in youth hockey? No.

It's about kids running and changing on the fly. Horns almost killed the game.


Forgive my ignorance, but what is (was) the horn?
Originally Posted by Anonymous
BRING BACK THE HORN!! For at least middle school and below. High School and club (all ages) I get it, but are we really trying to speed the game up in PAL or middle school?! Still trying to teach and get kids even time


Middle school does have the horn.
Instead of constructing a new headquarters building, put the money into age verification at tournaments. Get your priorities right! Unbelievable!
For girls youth, are they still allowing deputy? (goalie leaving the ball in the crease and a defender/middie going in and taking it?)
I'm very concerned about the unfair advantage obtained by those players (and coaches & parents) that play down and/or reclassify in elementary school.

Obviously, it is done to seek an athletic & academic over players in a normal (of age) year.

Concerns for safety are ignored. That will be on YOU if a young
player get hurt badly because this remains unregulated.

Concerns for integrity and fairness are ignored. A Cheater will cheat until stopped. This will be a blemish on the game.

The ripple effects are significant. Maybe a player looses a chance to play because of this. Maybe he/she quits the game. Maybe we never get to see how great they can be and they can't see how great this game is.

It is up to USA Lacrosse to protect the players, protect fairness, and protect the game.
AGE BASED TEAMS AT YOUTH LEVEL..What has happened to youth Lacrosse with the gaming the system for select children. This is awful and goes against the intent of youth sports.

Look at how soccer enforces age with a simple card system . They have many more players than lacrosse yet have no problem with age.

Grade base is destroying the integrity of youth Lacrosse. ENFORCE AGE USL. School is where grade based teams should be.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
For girls youth, are they still allowing deputy? (goalie leaving the ball in the crease and a defender/middie going in and taking it?)


Yes
Some great comments. Some great ideas.
First group of comments sent to USL today.
Growth of the game will rely and thrive on structure. ID cards and roster submission with player number, name, photo and birthdate should be submitted for any tournament sanctioned by US Lacrosse. Make this about the kids, future of lacrosse and not about business and money. Prioritize safety, development and fair competition. While the sport had grown, it will plateau if money is allowed to be the priority. Holding children back to play with a younger group is dangerous and unfair. If clubs or teams choose to play up , a waiver can be signed noting that said player or team knows the risks associated with their choice to play older kids. Playing older , bigger, stronger kids should be a choice, not a given where some kids have an advantage while others are unsuspecting and show up thinking they are playing age appropriate games. Hockey, soccer, baseball hold their players, teams and clubs accountable. They do not allow them to put money before safety. Lacrosse shouldn't allow this at the youth level either. Integrate a system starting with the next class and grandfather existing teams but put a 15-15 month range- as opposed to a 12 month range. So as not to totally disrupt the existing teams.
This is all great stuff. The power that US Lacrosse has here is that by adopting age guidelines (one year at a time is critical) they form a new tournament/league system. I.E. US Lacrosee sanctioned vs not. That way, when participating in a US Lacrosse sanctioned event you know all kids kids are within the same age group.
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
For girls youth, are they still allowing deputy? (goalie leaving the ball in the crease and a defender/middie going in and taking it?)


Yes


Nassau County PAL does not allow a deputy, except at the 2nd grade level.

Suffolk County Girls Lacrosse does not allow a deputy at all.
The reclassification in boys youth lacrosse is a major safety issue. Age restrictions for grade based teams need to be put in place. Having schools and clubs promote this practice is detrimental to the game.
Age classification for all ages...MUST present player pass with photo before EVERY game, for all ages below college. As players progress through HS, USA Lacrosse can use JV A, JV B, Varsity AA, Varsity A, Varsity B. U8 through U15 can use same AA,A,B competition level designations. I would not use the Soccer example of September 1 as a cut off, Keep it like hockey with 1/1/xxxx - 12/31/xxxx cut-off dates. Both more physical sports than soccer (although yes, soccer people - soccer is a physical sport as well)
Originally Posted by Anonymous
The reclassification in boys youth lacrosse is a major safety issue. Age restrictions for grade based teams need to be put in place. Having schools and clubs promote this practice is detrimental to the game.


Reclassification of age levels should revert back to a "U" based system. This way everyone on the field is the same age regardless of being red shirted or late birthdays being held back a grade. Its the only fair and safe way to do this.
Do not allow anonymous posts on lacrosse forums
Goalie should only be allowed one possession in the crease per team possession - similar to soccer where if a teammate kicks back to the goalie he may not use his hands - I hate when I see an aggressive ride stops when the clearing team throws to the goalie two or three times.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
This is all great stuff. The power that US Lacrosse has here is that by adopting age guidelines (one year at a time is critical) they form a new tournament/league system. I.E. US Lacrosee sanctioned vs not. That way, when participating in a US Lacrosse sanctioned event you know all kids kids are within the same age group.


Exactly
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
For girls youth, are they still allowing deputy? (goalie leaving the ball in the crease and a defender/middie going in and taking it?)


Yes


Nassau County PAL does not allow a deputy, except at the 2nd grade level.

Suffolk County Girls Lacrosse does not allow a deputy at all.


After review of the rules it appears you are correct. However, I witnessed dozens of HS games where the goalie utilized the deputy on clears. Interesting.....
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
For girls youth, are they still allowing deputy? (goalie leaving the ball in the crease and a defender/middie going in and taking it?)


Yes


Nassau County PAL does not allow a deputy, except at the 2nd grade level.

Suffolk County Girls Lacrosse does not allow a deputy at all.


After review of the rules it appears you are correct. However, I witnessed dozens of HS games where the goalie utilized the deputy on clears. Interesting.....


NCPAL allows it in second grade because they don't use goalies in 2nd grade division so a deputy is required to get the ball out of the goal circle
For girls'/women's lacrosse:

1) institute a shot clock to prevent the stall

2) better utilize the held flag so that there are fewer occurrences of a shot leading to a goal which is then called back and reset for a free position

3) allow only 6 players between the restraining line on draws until possession is gained by one team

4) keep track of player and team fouls better (refs or scorekeepers) so that more cards are issued for "repeated major fouls"

5) require scoring shooter to immediately drop their stick at all levels

6) require player ID cards with birthdate (issued by local USL chapters to make it more manageable)
Originally Posted by Anonymous
For girls'/women's lacrosse:

1) institute a shot clock to prevent the stall

2) better utilize the held flag so that there are fewer occurrences of a shot leading to a goal which is then called back and reset for a free position

3) allow only 6 players between the restraining line on draws until possession is gained by one team

4) keep track of player and team fouls better (refs or scorekeepers) so that more cards are issued for "repeated major fouls"

5) require scoring shooter to immediately drop their stick at all levels

6) require player ID cards with birthdate (issued by local USL chapters to make it more manageable)


I love all of these and think you are spot on...the only one I would maybe tweak is the shot clock. Perhaps a possession clock once your team gets it over the restraining line and into the offensive zone. I do not know the answer but something needs to be done
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
For girls youth, are they still allowing deputy? (goalie leaving the ball in the crease and a defender/middie going in and taking it?)


Yes


Nassau County PAL does not allow a deputy, except at the 2nd grade level.


That would be because the vast majority of refs have no idea what they're doing


Suffolk County Girls Lacrosse does not allow
a deputy at all.


After review of the rules it appears you are correct. However, I witnessed dozens of HS games where the goalie utilized the deputy on clears. Interesting.....


That's because the vast majority of girls refs have no idea what they're doing!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
For girls youth, are they still allowing deputy? (goalie leaving the ball in the crease and a defender/middie going in and taking it?)


Yes


Nassau County PAL does not allow a deputy, except at the 2nd grade level.


That would be because the vast majority of refs have no idea what they're doing


Suffolk County Girls Lacrosse does not allow
a deputy at all.


After review of the rules it appears you are correct. However, I witnessed dozens of HS games where the goalie utilized the deputy on clears. Interesting.....


That's because the vast majority of girls refs have no idea what they're doing!


that's why us lacrosse MUST institute a foul progression count on the girls side that leads to ejection. Take it out of the refs hands. Constant hackers must be sent to the locker room otherwise helmets are coming!! If a girl foluls out once I bet it never happens again
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
For girls youth, are they still allowing deputy? (goalie leaving the ball in the crease and a defender/middie going in and taking it?)


Yes


Nassau County PAL does not allow a deputy, except at the 2nd grade level.


That would be because the vast majority of refs have no idea what they're doing


Suffolk County Girls Lacrosse does not allow
a deputy at all.


After review of the rules it appears you are correct. However, I witnessed dozens of HS games where the goalie utilized the deputy on clears. Interesting.....


That's because the vast majority of girls refs have no idea what they're doing!


that's why us lacrosse MUST institute a foul progression count on the girls side that leads to ejection. Take it out of the refs hands. Constant hackers must be sent to the locker room otherwise helmets are coming!! If a girl foluls out once I bet it never happens again


If you think the game is slow now with the whistles wait till every foul has to be reported to the table like in a basketball game ... it will add 30 minutes to every game. the refs already have the ability to give a yellow card for multiple repetitive fouls. maybe that should be emphasized for next year.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
If you think the game is slow now with the whistles wait till every foul has to be reported to the table like in a basketball game ... it will add 30 minutes to every game. the refs already have the ability to give a yellow card for multiple repetitive fouls. maybe that should be emphasized for next year.



Wrong. The boys/mens game reports infractions to the table and it doesn't come close to adding "30 min" to the game. As it is right now, nobody knows what is going on because the culture of girls lacrosse has its officials who whisper the infractions to the players, confusing everyone.
Yellow card for a girl screaming "Got ball" so loud that you can hear it in the next county.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
AGE BASED TEAMS AT YOUTH LEVEL..What has happened to youth Lacrosse with the gaming the system for select children. This is awful and goes against the intent of youth sports.

Look at how soccer enforces age with a simple card system . They have many more players than lacrosse yet have no problem with age.

Grade base is destroying the integrity of youth Lacrosse. ENFORCE AGE USL. School is where grade based teams should be.


This is a critical issue for US Lacrosse to deal with. The advent of "grade based" rather than "age based" teams together with the rampant practice of "reclassifying" (in other words holding back kids) for the sole reason of getting an advantage of playing older, more physically mature (i.e. heavier and taller) against younger players has created an unsafe and absurd situation with 14 and in some cases 15 year olds playing against 12 year olds.


Originally Posted by Anonymous
[quote=Anonymous]AGE BASED TEAMS AT YOUTH LEVEL..What has happened to youth Lacrosse with the gaming the system for select children. This is awful and goes against the intent of youth sports.

Look at how soccer enforces age with a simple card system . They have many more players than lacrosse yet have no problem with age.

Grade base is destroying the integrity of youth Lacrosse. ENFORCE AGE USL. School is where grade based teams should be.


This is a critical issue for US Lacrosse to deal with. The advent of "grade based" rather than "age based" teams together with the rampant practice of "reclassifying" (in other words holding back kids) for the sole reason of getting an advantage of playing older, more physically mature (i.e. heavier and taller) against younger players has created an unsafe and absurd situation with 14 and in some cases 15 year olds playing against 12 year olds.


Your messages are being heard. Keep up the great work and continue to post your suggestions.
My vote is for the enforcement of the Dangerous Propelling on the girls side. Within the 8-meter arc, a girls' lacrosse player can't shoot without regard for the safety of the defenders. I can't tell you how many times I have seen a shooting space violation call in conjunction with an attacker shooting. In these instances, it should be called as offsetting violations and should result in a 50/50 toss. Enforce the rule or get rid of it.
They need age not grade classifications , why is appropriate to punish the kids who are age appropriate , is it fair that my 12 year old 7th grader is forced to play against teams that have mostly 14 year olds .
I agree 100 percent. 1000 percent actually. But let me ask you a question. Have you ever heard the phrase" beating a dead horse." This topic has been discussed thousands of times. Your 12 yr old son, is playing against 14 yr olds. Its sad, but nobody cares. It should be aged based. Making sports fair, is always in the best intetest of the kids and the sport. Age is fair. Your kid is having trouble in school, hold him back, do what's rite for your kid. However what does that have to do with lacrosse. Play your age. If my 14 yr old kid was dominating a 12 yr old kid. I'd actually feel guilty, like I was doing something wrong.
Travel lax controls the sport. Too much money at stake to implement change. This was broken a decade ago and it hasn't changed. If we were all running the sport maybe change would have a chance but we aren't
Lacrosse really does seem to be the only sport that supports this practice. How come the governing body, U.S. LAX, can't enforce any guidelines?

I think we all should just inundate US LAX email with this concern, maybe even take a day where we all decide to call at various different times of the day!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Lacrosse really does seem to be the only sport that supports this practice. How come the governing body, U.S. LAX, can't enforce any guidelines?

I think we all should just inundate US LAX email with this concern, maybe even take a day where we all decide to call at various different times of the day!


Because travel lax has never been bigger, so US Lax caters to the clubs and not the individuals. They could have to player cards years ago but didn't. The clubs just want to win and place kids in college so they are the biggest rule benders because it suits their FOR PROFIT business model. Bet your house that none of this changes - BUT MANY ARE REALLY GOOD IDEAS being shared by people who love and know the sport.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Lacrosse really does seem to be the only sport that supports this practice. How come the governing body, U.S. LAX, can't enforce any guidelines?

I think we all should just inundate US LAX email with this concern, maybe even take a day where we all decide to call at various different times of the day!


Because travel lax has never been bigger, so US Lax caters to the clubs and not the individuals. They could have to player cards years ago but didn't. The clubs just want to win and place kids in college so they are the biggest rule benders because it suits their FOR PROFIT business model. Bet your house that none of this changes - BUT MANY ARE REALLY GOOD IDEAS being shared by people who love and know the sport.


I'll take your bet. Please message your address so I can see if it's worth it.

US Lacrosse has been working on the right way to roll out an effective program of age verification for several years. They do in fact listen to the feedback we give.
As you can imagine there are security issues involved with documentation that parents will be required to submit and they have solved that. The software is in place and pilot programs are rolling out in the fall.

Your comment stating that US Lacrosse caters to the clubs because of money couldn't be further from accurate. They are committed to making necessary changes as times change while keeping the tradition of the game in place. It's no small task. Just look at your child's teams that have 22 players and witness the arguments and disagreements that take place within that small sphere. Imagine trying to properly guide the entire lacrosse playing world?

Give your feedback with issues and changes you think would be beneficial to our game.
i am happy that my youngest is going to be out of lacrosse by the time US Lacrosse ruins the summer travel circuit by going to age based instead of the correct and working grade based system. My son is a 2018 born in 2000 (age appropriate) and I want him to play against other kids in his grade for recruiting purposes. Playing against kids his age but in the grade below him will not help him get recruited or become a better player. if it's not broke don't fix it and don't change the rules because of a bunch of whiners who's kids can't compete. IMHO going to an aged based system will hurt kids that are age appropriate because they will play against kids in the recruiting year below and not improve and not get recruited.
People may have different opinions or arguments on certain topics. That's the way it is. One topic that is always discussed is age requirement. Pick a date, which you already have, (sept 1). That's part 1. Part 2, try to enforce that date somehow, like the other sports. I just don't see what the argument is. If everyone is the same age (within a yr), it is a more fair playing field and safer. What could the argument be to that. Its a factual statement. You want to hold your kid back for academics, social skills, I'm all for it. That should have nothing to do with playing lacrosse. The tournaments will still make money. Who is going to pull a kid out of a sport, because they now have to play with kids there own age. Your son may now be an average player, instead of a standout agsinst younger kids. That's life.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
i am happy that my youngest is going to be out of lacrosse by the time US Lacrosse ruins the summer travel circuit by going to age based instead of the correct and working grade based system. My son is a 2018 born in 2000 (age appropriate) and I want him to play against other kids in his grade for recruiting purposes. Playing against kids his age but in the grade below him will not help him get recruited or become a better player. if it's not broke don't fix it and don't change the rules because of a bunch of whiners who's kids can't compete. IMHO going to an aged based system will hurt kids that are age appropriate because they will play against kids in the recruiting year below and not improve and not get recruited.


Sorry, but that just made no sense whatsoever....
Lol. I have no idea what he is talking about.
Some kids start college at 20, some start at 18, in some cases 17. Do the math.that means some kids are 12, while other kids are 9 or 10. That's why age is the way to go. Seeing some of these youth tournaments, kids are double the size of other kids. Dont say some kids are big, some are little. I know that. The point is a huge majority aren't the same age. Also don't say college and hifh school kids play with older kids, I know that too. I'm talking about youth level. The guy talking about not getting recruited, or playing grade. I have no idea what he is saying. Every single youth sport has age, except this one. Is every other sport wrong.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
i am happy that my youngest is going to be out of lacrosse by the time US Lacrosse ruins the summer travel circuit by going to age based instead of the correct and working grade based system. My son is a 2018 born in 2000 (age appropriate) and I want him to play against other kids in his grade for recruiting purposes. Playing against kids his age but in the grade below him will not help him get recruited or become a better player. if it's not broke don't fix it and don't change the rules because of a bunch of whiners who's kids can't compete. IMHO going to an aged based system will hurt kids that are age appropriate because they will play against kids in the recruiting year below and not improve and not get recruited.


Your kid and those of his talent level are welcome to play UP and garner advanced attention that way.
Playing age appropriate does not ruin summer lacrosse. Playing down does.
Also the system IS broken that's why the change is coming.
When do you think this change will happen.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
i am happy that my youngest is going to be out of lacrosse by the time US Lacrosse ruins the summer travel circuit by going to age based instead of the correct and working grade based system. My son is a 2018 born in 2000 (age appropriate) and I want him to play against other kids in his grade for recruiting purposes. Playing against kids his age but in the grade below him will not help him get recruited or become a better player. if it's not broke don't fix it and don't change the rules because of a bunch of whiners who's kids can't compete. IMHO going to an aged based system will hurt kids that are age appropriate because they will play against kids in the recruiting year below and not improve and not get recruited.


There will be no prohibitions against kids playing up. If your kid is super elite he can play up if that is what you want from him.

The above quoted comment makes no sense. No matter what system is used, elite kids will get recruited. Are the coaches at Hopkins, Syracuse etc. blind and stupid?Please explain how a great player won't get recruited under an aged based system. These coaches are more than capable of watching a game with a roster list and noting which kids are 2018 and which kids are 2019. In fact, I would think age based games would be favored by the coaches. This will allow them to truly compare kids. Watching 14 year olds dominate 12 year olds just because their expected grad years are the same tells them little about the 14 year olds. It does not translate well to projecting the same kids when they are 20 vs 18, which is what the coaches should ultimately care about. But if they see a 14 year old dominate other 14 year olds, than they know with a much greater degree of certainty that said 14 year old is a D1 player. It doesn't matter much what grad year the kid is. If he projects as a D1 stud, offer him a position in whatever grad class he happens to be in.

The bottom line is that by going to an age based system, recruiting is IMPROVED for both the coaches AND the kids. Coaches can watch kids play against kids their own age, which is the best way to compare them, and therefore, project how they will perform when they are 18+. This is the best system for the kids for the same reason. A coach can go to a game and watch 14 year olds. They can then identify maybe 3 kids that they believe are sure bets to be good D1 players. They can then offer them. The fact that 2 will be offered in the 2018 entering class and one will be offered in the 2019 class is meaningless to them. The coaches are more than capable of managing multiple classes at once. They do it now.
Well said
Then what would keep a defender from constantly jumping into shooting space? Poor lazy defense would get rewarded over and over again! Every time a shot is about to be made the defender can just jump in the way and it would result in a 50 50. Please think it through before you make a silly suggestion. If you think that a girl can stop her shot when she's already started the motion as a defender jumps in front, you are seriously mistaken.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Then what would keep a defender from constantly jumping into shooting space? Poor lazy defense would get rewarded over and over again! Every time a shot is about to be made the defender can just jump in the way and it would result in a 50 50. Please think it through before you make a silly suggestion. If you think that a girl can stop her shot when she's already started the motion as a defender jumps in front, you are seriously mistaken.



To use your words..."Please think it through before you make a silly post. "

It's really quite simple and is already a directive to officials. You ready? Here it is.
Officials are directed to ACTUALLY CALL SHOOTING SPACE WHEN IT HAPPENS....BEFORE THE SHOT TAKES PLACE.
If the "lazy" defense you described does what you said then there will be a ton of free positions...not a good defensive plan.

Also, shooters will need to NOT shoot when there is a player in the space. If they do in fact shoot during a shooting space situation then it is a foul on the shooter as well as it should be.

Why do you have an objection to and difficulty with calling this foul?
My difficulty with this rule is that the officials rarely call the foul early enough for the shooter to stop her shot. Many times it's not the official's fault as much as it is the fact that it is a "bang bang" play. Defender steps into shooting space as shooter is shooting. In my 3 years experience of coaching girl's lacrosse, over 95% of these fouls are called by the officials this way...simultaneously, while the shooter is shooting, with no chance of their stopping their shot. So although "The Rule" reads nice, it rarely occurs or is called in a fashion that the shooter can stop their shot. So the shot which resulted in a goal is disallowed and a free position is awarded (maybe awarded...if a foul is not called on a dangerous shot). If both fouls are called for a dangerous shot on the shooter and shooting space on the defender, correct me if i'm wrong, but a free position is NOT awarded...thus rewarding the defense. It is my opinion that if the shooter has no time to stop there shot because of the last second shooting space violation, that the shot should count. I understand the rule is for safety but, it only rewards the defense, even if a free position is awarded. A shot was going to be taken anyway. If the violation happens early and is called early I have no objection with calling a dangerous shot...it just rarely seems to happen that way.
I understand your position but disagree that it only rewards the defense.
I have seen many times when a goalie saves the initial shot only to have the shooter awarded another try with a free position. If the shooter scores she clearly gained an advantage.
It will take adjustments from officials and players if this rule is to be enforced as written. Hopefully it happens because too many defenders are being injured.
Wanna know why U S Lacross will never take the issue of SAFETY and proper age classification seriously. One of the members of the U.S. lacrosse sports science and safety committee ( a physician) has a "2019 Gilman" son that stands probably 6'2" and 200+ lbs. clearly a player that would be big for a sophomore instead of playing against 13 & 14 yr old incoming frosh.

They have people on that committee that will never give it any credence.

Instead of giving "little johnnie" steroids to make him a superior athlete, the better idea is to hold him back once (or TWICE) to be a superior athlete. That's fair! Right, Doc?

Originally Posted by Anonymous
Wanna know why U S Lacross will never take the issue of SAFETY and proper age classification seriously. One of the members of the U.S. lacrosse sports science and safety committee ( a physician) has a "2019 Gilman" son that stands probably 6'2" and 200+ lbs. clearly a player that would be big for a sophomore instead of playing against 13 & 14 yr old incoming frosh.

They have people on that committee that will never give it any credence.

Instead of giving "little johnnie" steroids to make him a superior athlete, the better idea is to hold him back once (or TWICE) to be a superior athlete. That's fair! Right, Doc?



Since you feel you have information that may have some bearing on the committee chairs ability to act with the best interest of USL at heart I suggest you contact them directly.

Your efforts will be better served if you take this on and don't stop if you have proof of your accusations.
I am interested as well to see if you are right. If you are we have all been bamboozled and changes should be made.
Let us know how you do OK.
GIRLS YOUTH RULES

I have rising 9th and 7th grade girls and a 3-year daughter. I have helped coach them in various years starting when my oldest was in 2nd grade.

Girls are not getting enough touches and it is not a good game. I am in a non-hotbed area but girls lacrosse is very popular.

I think girls need to play on a small field and play no more than 9v9 (and I think 7v7 would be better) through U11. They need to get more touches to learn to play a passing game. Right now, even JV girls teams don't pass as well as U11 boys. I don't think it is because of the stick and skills - though that may be part of it - I think it is because they don't learn to pass because they can just run by girls and score.

I intend to do with this my 3 year old as she gets older regardless, but I'd love to see the girls game develop into a beautiful game before High School.
I think U.S. Lacrosse should move to a single-year age divisions, except when two-year divisions are necessary for numbers. For boys, however, I think the 9.1 cutoff should be moved to 8/1, as I think many if not most boys with August birthdays now start kindergarten along with younger kids.

I have been to many reputable Summer and Fall tournaments over the last several years. Only Hogan's and [lacrosse]'s actually follow age rules (and [lacrosse]'s moved from an 8/1 cutoff to 6/1, which I think is too early). I have seen 4th graders playing 7th graders. I see teams playing down time and time again.

I don't necessarily think single-year grade divisions are that bad, until you start seeing holdbacks, at least compared to two-year age divisions. Even before holdbacks, however, it is obvious how many older kids populate single-year grade teams. I would speculate it is common to have 4-8 kids on a single-year grade team that are older than U.S. Lacrosse's 9/1 cutoff. It makes competition largely about who's older versus who's more skilled. That's not good for the sport or safety.
A question for the HOP, GREAT THREAD, lots of GREAT IDEAS but after years and years and years of inaction by US lacrosse, why do you think now is the time that real change will be instituted. Do you have inside info? The things brought up in this thread have been going on forever and others have tried to implement change and it has always fallen on deaf ears.

I hope this time its different!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
GIRLS YOUTH RULES

I have rising 9th and 7th grade girls and a 3-year daughter. I have helped coach them in various years starting when my oldest was in 2nd grade.

Girls are not getting enough touches and it is not a good game. I am in a non-hotbed area but girls lacrosse is very popular.

I think girls need to play on a small field and play no more than 9v9 (and I think 7v7 would be better) through U11. They need to get more touches to learn to play a passing game. Right now, even JV girls teams don't pass as well as U11 boys. I don't think it is because of the stick and skills - though that may be part of it - I think it is because they don't learn to pass because they can just run by girls and score.

I intend to do with this my 3 year old as she gets older regardless, but I'd love to see the girls game develop into a beautiful game before High School.


There is a reason soccer went to fewer players and smaller fields, it was to retain players because they were part of the game. Lacrosse kids quit in droves because many never touch the ball. Can't tell you how many times when we were in the 3 pass rule age that the goalie passed to one player, that player passed back to the goalie then the goalie returned to the passing player and that player ran from 1 cage to the other to shoot and score! That's lacrosee? Everyone else just stood around and watched. Every other healthy sport accepts that most kids wont play in college or get a scholarship. In Lax if you aren't playing year round for a full ride you are shunned
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
GIRLS YOUTH RULES

I have rising 9th and 7th grade girls and a 3-year daughter. I have helped coach them in various years starting when my oldest was in 2nd grade.

Girls are not getting enough touches and it is not a good game. I am in a non-hotbed area but girls lacrosse is very popular.

I think girls need to play on a small field and play no more than 9v9 (and I think 7v7 would be better) through U11. They need to get more touches to learn to play a passing game. Right now, even JV girls teams don't pass as well as U11 boys. I don't think it is because of the stick and skills - though that may be part of it - I think it is because they don't learn to pass because they can just run by girls and score.

I intend to do with this my 3 year old as she gets older regardless, but I'd love to see the girls game develop into a beautiful game before High School.


There is a reason soccer went to fewer players and smaller fields, it was to retain players because they were part of the game. Lacrosse kids quit in droves because many never touch the ball. Can't tell you how many times when we were in the 3 pass rule age that the goalie passed to one player, that player passed back to the goalie then the goalie returned to the passing player and that player ran from 1 cage to the other to shoot and score! That's lacrosee? Everyone else just stood around and watched. Every other healthy sport accepts that most kids wont play in college or get a scholarship. In Lax if you aren't playing year round for a full ride you are shunned


I assume you are exaggerating with your goalie example, but if that really happened it was the coach's fault for not stopping it. Usually, the goalie clear doesn't count as a pass and where passes are required, at least one has to be in the offensive end so this would never be allowed anyway.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
A question for the HOP, GREAT THREAD, lots of GREAT IDEAS but after years and years and years of inaction by US lacrosse, why do you think now is the time that real change will be instituted. Do you have inside info? The things brought up in this thread have been going on forever and others have tried to implement change and it has always fallen on deaf ears.

I hope this time its different!


This time is different. USL is actively addressing many of the issues discussed here.
Age verification for one will be rolled out with pilot programs this spring. Other changes are coming as well.
With decreasing growth numbers it's time.
I am involved with USL to answer your question and thank you for your input.
I hope that change is coming but I have a hard time thinking age verification is on its way anytime soon. Some of these teams are half holdbacks or are just flat out playing down. I would think there is going to be a lot of resistance. My other question is why wouldn't college coaches be pushing for this. How do you know what level a kid is really at when he could be playing kids a year or more younger.
I hope change is coming. It just makes youth lacrosse more legit. My son is 12 yrs old. When he plays a great game against 12 yr old kids, I tell him great job, I'm so happy for him. If he were to play a great game against 10, 11 yr olds, I'd say great job, but in the back of my head , I'd say he did it against younger kids, he should play great. It dosent have the same feeling. I'm sure thousands of people have examples like that.
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
A question for the HOP, GREAT THREAD, lots of GREAT IDEAS but after years and years and years of inaction by US lacrosse, why do you think now is the time that real change will be instituted. Do you have inside info? The things brought up in this thread have been going on forever and others have tried to implement change and it has always fallen on deaf ears.

I hope this time its different!


This time is different. USL is actively addressing many of the issues discussed here.
Age verification for one will be rolled out with pilot programs this spring. Other changes are coming as well.
With decreasing growth numbers it's time.


I am involved with USL to answer your question and thank you for your input.


Can is lax take insurance away from clubs, leagues, and tournaments that don't follow the guidelines?
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
A question for the HOP, GREAT THREAD, lots of GREAT IDEAS but after years and years and years of inaction by US lacrosse, why do you think now is the time that real change will be instituted. Do you have inside info? The things brought up in this thread have been going on forever and others have tried to implement change and it has always fallen on deaf ears.

I hope this time its different!


This time is different. USL is actively addressing many of the issues discussed here.
Age verification for one will be rolled out with pilot programs this spring. Other changes are coming as well.
With decreasing growth numbers it's time.


I am involved with USL to answer your question and thank you for your input.


Can is lax take insurance away from clubs, leagues, and tournaments that don't follow the guidelines?


My worry is that many of the tournaments are not USL sanctioned, so even if they apply guidelines, your bigger clubs, your business focused clubs, those that promote holdbacks or turn a blind eye, will just attend other tournaments, making USL tournaments somewhat shunned. It seems like this may divide the lax community even more. I think guidelines are needed, I just don't know if clubs will be able to avoid them with their own tournaments and creativity to continue to manipulate the system. I think if college recruiting showcases and events really forced kids into age appropriate play, you might see a change, but that doesn't seem to be coming down the pike any time soon. I do give credit to USL for stepping up and trying to implement change.
Kind of off topib but, What is gonna happen when early committs dont either get the grades and/or the SAT scores needed to get thru the admissions processes...I am not talking,by a point or 2,but a vast difference...Any Thoughts?
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
A question for the HOP, GREAT THREAD, lots of GREAT IDEAS but after years and years and years of inaction by US lacrosse, why do you think now is the time that real change will be instituted. Do you have inside info? The things brought up in this thread have been going on forever and others have tried to implement change and it has always fallen on deaf ears.

I hope this time its different!



This time is different. USL is actively addressing many of the issues discussed here.
Age verification for one will be rolled out with pilot programs this spring. Other changes are coming as well.
With decreasing growth numbers it's time.


I am involved with USL to answer your question and thank you for your input.


Can is lax take insurance away from clubs, leagues, and tournaments that don't follow the guidelines?


My worry is that many of the tournaments are not USL sanctioned, so even if they apply guidelines, your bigger clubs, your business focused clubs, those that promote holdbacks or turn a blind eye, will just attend other tournaments, making USL tournaments somewhat shunned. It seems like this may divide the lax community even more. I think guidelines are needed, I just don't know if clubs will be able to avoid them with their own tournaments and creativity to continue to manipulate the system. I think if college recruiting showcases and events really forced kids into age appropriate play, you might see a change, but that doesn't seem to be coming down the pike any time soon. I do give credit to USL for stepping up and trying to implement change.


I'm wondering that since this will roll out in the spring (2016), how will it affect all the travel teams next summer? Tryouts for Summer 2016 begin a month from now under the current 'grade' trend.

Next summer will be a mess with even more complaints and could snuff out the efforts, giving the illusion of a failed system.

Is the implementation then technically two seasons out?...since the tryouts next summer (2016) will only get the system on track for the spring of 2017?
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
GIRLS YOUTH RULES

I have rising 9th and 7th grade girls and a 3-year daughter. I have helped coach them in various years starting when my oldest was in 2nd grade.

Girls are not getting enough touches and it is not a good game. I am in a non-hotbed area but girls lacrosse is very popular.

I think girls need to play on a small field and play no more than 9v9 (and I think 7v7 would be better) through U11. They need to get more touches to learn to play a passing game. Right now, even JV girls teams don't pass as well as U11 boys. I don't think it is because of the stick and skills - though that may be part of it - I think it is because they don't learn to pass because they can just run by girls and score.

I intend to do with this my 3 year old as she gets older regardless, but I'd love to see the girls game develop into a beautiful game before High School.


There is a reason soccer went to fewer players and smaller fields, it was to retain players because they were part of the game. Lacrosse kids quit in droves because many never touch the ball. Can't tell you how many times when we were in the 3 pass rule age that the goalie passed to one player, that player passed back to the goalie then the goalie returned to the passing player and that player ran from 1 cage to the other to shoot and score! That's lacrosee? Everyone else just stood around and watched. Every other healthy sport accepts that most kids wont play in college or get a scholarship. In Lax if you aren't playing year round for a full ride you are shunned


Any youth league that has a mandatory pass rule needs to require that the passes occur in the box, and that the passes, in the judgment of the referee, are productive lacrosse passes and not just 2 foot passes to just satisfy the rule. I have never seen this done in practice, but this is how I would do it if I were in charge.

Another rule I would like to see at the youth level that I have never actually seen is a rule that limits the amount of goals that a player can score per game. Another rule that I have seen in other sports is that if your team wins by a certain inflated score, the win does not count.

Yet another possible rule - again one I have never actually seen - is to have a one-dodge rule at the lowest youth levels. This would mean that a kid can dodge one opponent, but then must give up the ball with a pass or shot. He can not dodge the second kid. Maybe this rule should be limited to the offensive half, permitting kids to clear the ball with legs. Again, these rules have, to my knowledge, never been used. They are just things I have dreamed up while watching games.

Keep in mind that I am referring to town teams and leagues, where growth is needed. Leagues where any kid with a pulse gets to play. Other sports modify their rules significantly at the youth level - baseball, football, and basketball do. Lacrosse needs to do so as well. These other sports, mostly baseball and basketball, modify less when travel teams are playing where the skill level is higher.

But with lacrosse, at the town level, 2/3/4 graders are mostly playing on the same size field as older kids, with the same rules. The only exception may be the lack of man down situations (which doesn't affect game play), and more conservative whistles with regard to hitting, which affects safety but not necessarily game play. There seems to be no modification of rules that permits more kids to be meaningfully involved, and for the game to flow better and be more balanced.

A lot has to do with the coaching also. My son has been blessed to be on a Town team where the coach has stressed passing since the kids first put on pads. They now pass to a fault and pass circles around other teams. All kids get touches and they almost always win. They give up many goals by passing to less skilled kids (who drop the ball) and sometimes lose a game because of it. But the kids have been drilled since they started to pass the ball, and are reaping the benefits of it now. I have literally seen them get up something like 8-0 and have 8 different kids score - all organically, meaning the coach is not doing anything to manufacture this, other than run his program where passing is required.

By contrast, almost all of our opponents are coached by men who simply yell "go, go, go, go to the cage" whenever one of their athletic kids gets the ball, even if its on their defensive side. The parents do the same. And yes, these kids score goals, and sometimes enough to beat us (although rare), but our kids are having more fun overall, and will be better players as they get older. Its a self-fulfilling philosophy used by these coaches. They don't emphasize passing so they never get good at it, which forces them to just have athletes run to the cage to score in order to stay in games, which thusly retards their growth at passing the ball, which then requires more one on one play to stay competitive, which leads to ... And these towns, which almost always have many times more kids available to them, wind up with less players enrolled than we have.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Kind of off topib but, What is gonna happen when early committs dont either get the grades and/or the SAT scores needed to get thru the admissions processes...I am not talking,by a point or 2,but a vast difference...Any Thoughts?


doesn't happen in MD, most of the commits are 20 years old since they did pre first and reclassed in 8th grade. they are more mature than most.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
GIRLS YOUTH RULES

I have rising 9th and 7th grade girls and a 3-year daughter. I have helped coach them in various years starting when my oldest was in 2nd grade.

Girls are not getting enough touches and it is not a good game. I am in a non-hotbed area but girls lacrosse is very popular.

I think girls need to play on a small field and play no more than 9v9 (and I think 7v7 would be better) through U11. They need to get more touches to learn to play a passing game. Right now, even JV girls teams don't pass as well as U11 boys. I don't think it is because of the stick and skills - though that may be part of it - I think it is because they don't learn to pass because they can just run by girls and score.

I intend to do with this my 3 year old as she gets older regardless, but I'd love to see the girls game develop into a beautiful game before High School.


There is a reason soccer went to fewer players and smaller fields, it was to retain players because they were part of the game. Lacrosse kids quit in droves because many never touch the ball. Can't tell you how many times when we were in the 3 pass rule age that the goalie passed to one player, that player passed back to the goalie then the goalie returned to the passing player and that player ran from 1 cage to the other to shoot and score! That's lacrosee? Everyone else just stood around and watched. Every other healthy sport accepts that most kids wont play in college or get a scholarship. In Lax if you aren't playing year round for a full ride you are shunned


Any youth league that has a mandatory pass rule needs to require that the passes occur in the box, and that the passes, in the judgment of the referee, are productive lacrosse passes and not just 2 foot passes to just satisfy the rule. I have never seen this done in practice, but this is how I would do it if I were in charge.

Another rule I would like to see at the youth level that I have never actually seen is a rule that limits the amount of goals that a player can score per game. Another rule that I have seen in other sports is that if your team wins by a certain inflated score, the win does not count.

Yet another possible rule - again one I have never actually seen - is to have a one-dodge rule at the lowest youth levels. This would mean that a kid can dodge one opponent, but then must give up the ball with a pass or shot. He can not dodge the second kid. Maybe this rule should be limited to the offensive half, permitting kids to clear the ball with legs. Again, these rules have, to my knowledge, never been used. They are just things I have dreamed up while watching games.

Keep in mind that I am referring to town teams and leagues, where growth is needed. Leagues where any kid with a pulse gets to play. Other sports modify their rules significantly at the youth level - baseball, football, and basketball do. Lacrosse needs to do so as well. These other sports, mostly baseball and basketball, modify less when travel teams are playing where the skill level is higher.

But with lacrosse, at the town level, 2/3/4 graders are mostly playing on the same size field as older kids, with the same rules. The only exception may be the lack of man down situations (which doesn't affect game play), and more conservative whistles with regard to hitting, which affects safety but not necessarily game play. There seems to be no modification of rules that permits more kids to be meaningfully involved, and for the game to flow better and be more balanced.

A lot has to do with the coaching also. My son has been blessed to be on a Town team where the coach has stressed passing since the kids first put on pads. They now pass to a fault and pass circles around other teams. All kids get touches and they almost always win. They give up many goals by passing to less skilled kids (who drop the ball) and sometimes lose a game because of it. But the kids have been drilled since they started to pass the ball, and are reaping the benefits of it now. I have literally seen them get up something like 8-0 and have 8 different kids score - all organically, meaning the coach is not doing anything to manufacture this, other than run his program where passing is required.

By contrast, almost all of our opponents are coached by men who simply yell "go, go, go, go to the cage" whenever one of their athletic kids gets the ball, even if its on their defensive side. The parents do the same. And yes, these kids score goals, and sometimes enough to beat us (although rare), but our kids are having more fun overall, and will be better players as they get older. Its a self-fulfilling philosophy used by these coaches. They don't emphasize passing so they never get good at it, which forces them to just have athletes run to the cage to score in order to stay in games, which thusly retards their growth at passing the ball, which then requires more one on one play to stay competitive, which leads to ... And these towns, which almost always have many times more kids available to them, wind up with less players enrolled than we have.


Really good stuff. We know of a youth basketball and soccer league where you score x amount of points or goals and you are removed from the game. After sitting on the bench it never happens again and the next time they pass the ball. Would never work in Lax where stat padding is accepted by everyone. Not uncommon to have strong kids on weak teams scoring 10 a game. It all goes back to everyone trying to lock up their verbal. It's ruining the game for the masses while rewarding only the top players.
OK,Outside of Maryland....I can not imagine all the early committs making the grade all the time to every school..Seems like alot of scrambling will be going on.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
OK,Outside of Maryland....I can not imagine all the early committs making the grade all the time to every school..Seems like alot of scrambling will be going on.


Great question! My friend gave a verbal last fall (2017) and failed math again. And she didn't take an SAT yet.
Case in point! Or the kid doesnt get the SAT Score to get into the school...For the very few a coach will go to bat for to get them in.others will be told,sorry...and rightly so..after all,they are not going to do well in school,and drag down the team GPA.



Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
OK,Outside of Maryland....I can not imagine all the early committs making the grade all the time to every school..Seems like alot of scrambling will be going on.


Great question! My friend gave a verbal last fall (2017) and failed math again. And she didn't take an SAT yet.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Case in point! Or the kid doesnt get the SAT Score to get into the school...For the very few a coach will go to bat for to get them in.others will be told,sorry...and rightly so..after all,they are not going to do well in school,and drag down the team GPA.



Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
OK,Outside of Maryland....I can not imagine all the early committs making the grade all the time to every school..Seems like alot of scrambling will be going on.


Great question! My friend gave a verbal last fall (2017) and failed math again. And she didn't take an SAT yet.
too much time on the wall under dad's watchful eye. Open a book!
have fixed rosters at the beginning of the season with some flexibility to accept the kid who just moved to the area, and allowing players to move up,(ie..an "A" players moving up to "AA"), but not allowing players to move down during the season or for tournaments. also, have a deadline to allow clubs to move players up.

seen too many "A" teams show up to a tournament with their clubs "AA" players. kids tryout and make teams based on their abilities demonstrated, it is wrong for clubs to play kids with higher abilities take advantage of lower bracket tournaments just so they can show off the hardware on their websites!
In regards to making the grade/SAT scores: doesn't take a whole lot of smarts for Div 1 teams if a coach really wants you.



Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
i am happy that my youngest is going to be out of lacrosse by the time US Lacrosse ruins the summer travel circuit by going to age based instead of the correct and working grade based system. My son is a 2018 born in 2000 (age appropriate) and I want him to play against other kids in his grade for recruiting purposes. Playing against kids his age but in the grade below him will not help him get recruited or become a better player. if it's not broke don't fix it and don't change the rules because of a bunch of whiners who's kids can't compete. IMHO going to an aged based system will hurt kids that are age appropriate because they will play against kids in the recruiting year below and not improve and not get recruited.


Your kid and those of his talent level are welcome to play UP and garner advanced attention that way.
Playing age appropriate does not ruin summer lacrosse. Playing down does.
Also the system IS broken that's why the change is coming.


I just posted in the 2018 thread a solution of age based to a level e.g. U15? And then go grade for the JV and Varsity years. My rationale is that at the HS level the blending the ages seems to be a lot less disparate.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
i am happy that my youngest is going to be out of lacrosse by the time US Lacrosse ruins the summer travel circuit by going to age based instead of the correct and working grade based system. My son is a 2018 born in 2000 (age appropriate) and I want him to play against other kids in his grade for recruiting purposes. Playing against kids his age but in the grade below him will not help him get recruited or become a better player. if it's not broke don't fix it and don't change the rules because of a bunch of whiners who's kids can't compete. IMHO going to an aged based system will hurt kids that are age appropriate because they will play against kids in the recruiting year below and not improve and not get recruited.


Your kid and those of his talent level are welcome to play UP and garner advanced attention that way.
Playing age appropriate does not ruin summer lacrosse. Playing down does.
Also the system IS broken that's why the change is coming.


I just posted in the 2018 thread a solution of age based to a level e.g. U15? And then go grade for the JV and Varsity years. My rationale is that at the HS level the blending the ages seems to be a lot less disparate.


It is a simple fix. Besides the few people like this supposedly " my son is great and doesnt want to play against anyone that is his age but not grade " . Most know that age base teams up to U15 are the right way to go..Like U11, u12 U13, etc...All HS teams should be grade base.

Like the other poster said..You are free to play up any time you want. But I doubt he will..only that is for us masses!
Just follow USA Hockey guidelines. 1/1 through 12/31. So the 2004 team is 1/1/2004 - 12/31/2004 birthdays. Really simple. No mid year cut off dates. If you are born in 2004, that is the team you are on!

Originally Posted by Anonymous
Just follow USA Hockey guidelines. 1/1 through 12/31. So the 2004 team is 1/1/2004 - 12/31/2004 birthdays. Really simple. No mid year cut off dates. If you are born in 2004, that is the team you are on!



Exactly this. And where lacrosse combines grades when needed (3/4, 5/6 etc), due to less kids, or lower skilled teams, they would simply combine years, like hockey does with Mites, Squits, Pee Wees etc.

Lacrosse should do this universally starting with the 2009s for the 2016-17 season. That way, current teams don't need to be broken up. It will quickly become the new normal for the next generation coming up. If its done universally in all areas at all levels it will work great, will not impact recruiting, and will not impact the bottom line for the for-profit organizations.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Just follow USA Hockey guidelines. 1/1 through 12/31. So the 2004 team is 1/1/2004 - 12/31/2004 birthdays. Really simple. No mid year cut off dates. If you are born in 2004, that is the team you are on!



I agree- easy clear cut off- no mid year dates. It'll never happen because parents will have heart attacks and coaches will scream, but it is a cut and dry way to go forward without all the fuss.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Just follow USA Hockey guidelines. 1/1 through 12/31. So the 2004 team is 1/1/2004 - 12/31/2004 birthdays. Really simple. No mid year cut off dates. If you are born in 2004, that is the team you are on!



I agree- easy clear cut off- no mid year dates. It'll never happen because parents will have heart attacks and coaches will scream, but it is a cut and dry way to go forward without all the fuss.


Not to repeat myself from above, but parents and coaches won't complain (or at least shouldn't) if its done just for the kids who are, as of now, not yet old enough to play. Leave existing teams alone, and start it for birth years 2009 and later for the 2016-2017 season and beyond.
Hockey format agreed. So easy. No strange cut off dates. Just get it done. And do it for all teams starting now before tryouts.
2005 tryouts.
2006 tryouts.
Etc.
Has a nice ring and it is SO SIMPLE ITS RIDICULOUS!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Instead of constructing a new headquarters building, put the money into age verification at tournaments. Get your priorities right! Unbelievable!


That and meaningfully certify equipment or don't do it all all. The honor system debacle this year should have embarrassed them enough to set up a fair system instead of taking a manufacturer' sword for it and selling a certification.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Just follow USA Hockey guidelines. 1/1 through 12/31. So the 2004 team is 1/1/2004 - 12/31/2004 birthdays. Really simple. No mid year cut off dates. If you are born in 2004, that is the team you are on!



Exactly this. And where lacrosse combines grades when needed (3/4, 5/6 etc), due to less kids, or lower skilled teams, they would simply combine years, like hockey does with Mites, Squits, Pee Wees etc.

Lacrosse should do this universally starting with the 2009s for the 2016-17 season. That way, current teams don't need to be broken up. It will quickly become the new normal for the next generation coming up. If its done universally in all areas at all levels it will work great, will not impact recruiting, and will not impact the bottom line for the for-profit organizations.


Okay- agreed that starting with new teams this should be implemented and is as clear as can be, however, there are many years that will still have to wallow through all the age disparity among teams in tournaments. If we are leveling the field because safety is a priority, then there needs to be some sort of rules also put in place for existing teams- maybe it is not the team itself, but the tournament age guidelines for the older, already existing groups. Kids in late elementary and even early middle school still have a way to go and should also be protected and be able to play in a fair and stable experience as they continue to develop and grow. Playing up should be allowed, with waivers signed by coach and parent.
Soccer is much bigger than hockey and has successfully implemented age groups. The soccer model should be followed rather than hockey. When you go teams based off two years (2000 & 2002), in the hockey model, there will be the younger kids on the team playing against kids two grades higher. The soccer model wouldn't allow this, at most you would only play kids one year older unless the child was left back.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Just follow USA Hockey guidelines. 1/1 through 12/31. So the 2004 team is 1/1/2004 - 12/31/2004 birthdays. Really simple. No mid year cut off dates. If you are born in 2004, that is the team you are on!



Exactly this. And where lacrosse combines grades when needed (3/4, 5/6 etc), due to less kids, or lower skilled teams, they would simply combine years, like hockey does with Mites, Squits, Pee Wees etc.

Lacrosse should do this universally starting with the 2009s for the 2016-17 season. That way, current teams don't need to be broken up. It will quickly become the new normal for the next generation coming up. If its done universally in all areas at all levels it will work great, will not impact recruiting, and will not impact the bottom line for the for-profit organizations.


Okay- agreed that starting with new teams this should be implemented and is as clear as can be, however, there are many years that will still have to wallow through all the age disparity among teams in tournaments. If we are leveling the field because safety is a priority, then there needs to be some sort of rules also put in place for existing teams- maybe it is not the team itself, but the tournament age guidelines for the older, already existing groups. Kids in late elementary and even early middle school still have a way to go and should also be protected and be able to play in a fair and stable experience as they continue to develop and grow. Playing up should be allowed, with waivers signed by coach and parent.


Why would you not include all age groups right from the start? Too bad if a team is "broken up" they will find new players and be fine. This is youth sports, not neurosurgery! If they were carrying older players, it was not the right thing to do in the first place. In our own lives, laws change and we adapt our behavior. Should not be that big of a deal. Unless of course you spent $$$ yo reclass your kid for athelte advantage!
Nice idea but will never happen in our lifetime. Major clubs not on board, they do not want or need USL.
From NCAA website:


Womenís lacrosse will have a 90-second possession clock by 2017 season

Greg Johnson | NCAA.com


Last Updated - Jul 16, 2015 17:04 EDT


A visible 90-second possession clock is coming to NCAA womenís lacrosse competition.

The NCAA Playing Rules Oversight Panel on Thursday approved adding a possession clock in the sport by the 2017 season in Division I, and by 2018 in Divisions II and III.

Delaying the implementation of the possession clock is warranted because it provides schools time to budget for any financial implications. The Womenís Lacrosse Rules Committee is recommending using two clocks, one on each end of the field. However, one clock located at the scorerís table will also be allowed.

Under the 90-second possession clock rule, the offensive team must register a shot within that window or the opposition will be awarded the ball at its location on the field when time expired.

The clock will be reset on a shot that is deflected by the goalkeeper or on a shot that hits the piping on the goal. The clock will also reset on all changes of possession and when any card has been issued to the team without possession.

The possession clock will keep counting down toward zero on shots that go wide or high of the goal.

The rules committee hopes the new rule limits the abuse of clock management and increases the pace of play.

Self-restarts

The panel approved allowing players to do self-restarts following minor or major foul calls outside of the critical scoring area (defined as inside the 12-meter arc and the corresponding area behind the goal), beginning with the 2016 season. Players would still have the option of waiting for the penalty to be administered.

Players called for major fouls must stand at least 4 meters behind the player with the ball on a restart, and players called for minor fouls must stand at least 4 meters to the side of the player with the ball on restarts.

As with the possession clock rule, the committee believes giving players the option of restarting play quickly can speed up the pace of play.

Stick checks

Officials will conduct stick checks of every goal-scoring stick following each goal scored, beginning next season. The rule is currently used in international play.

There will also be more extensive stick checks before the start of the game, with officials examining more than just the pocket depth.

Coaches will maintain their three stick-check requests and will be allowed to use them before any faceoff, during timeouts, at halftime and before the start of any overtime periods.

If a player is found to be using a stick that doesnít meet the specifications, that player will be given a yellow card and must serve a two-minute, non-releasable penalty.

Alternating possession

Starting next season, there will no longer be throw-ins following an offsetting foul call. Instead, an alternating possession rule will cover those scenarios. The first possession arrow will be determined at the coin toss, when the winning captains choose direction or possession.

Overtime change

In the event a game goes to overtime in 2016, teams will use a sudden-victory format and change ends every three minutes.

Previously, the team that scored the most goals in two three-minute periods won the match.

Three-second violation change

Starting in 2016, three-second violations will be considered a minor foul.

If a defender is inside the 8-meter arc and not guarding anyone for three seconds, the offensive team is given possession of the ball at the 12-meter arc, where it can initiate an indirect play (pass to a teammate) on goal.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
From NCAA website:


Womenís lacrosse will have a 90-second possession clock by 2017 season

Greg Johnson | NCAA.com


Last Updated - Jul 16, 2015 17:04 EDT


A visible 90-second possession clock is coming to NCAA womenís lacrosse competition.

The NCAA Playing Rules Oversight Panel on Thursday approved adding a possession clock in the sport by the 2017 season in Division I, and by 2018 in Divisions II and III.

Delaying the implementation of the possession clock is warranted because it provides schools time to budget for any financial implications. The Womenís Lacrosse Rules Committee is recommending using two clocks, one on each end of the field. However, one clock located at the scorerís table will also be allowed.

Under the 90-second possession clock rule, the offensive team must register a shot within that window or the opposition will be awarded the ball at its location on the field when time expired.

The clock will be reset on a shot that is deflected by the goalkeeper or on a shot that hits the piping on the goal. The clock will also reset on all changes of possession and when any card has been issued to the team without possession.

The possession clock will keep counting down toward zero on shots that go wide or high of the goal.

The rules committee hopes the new rule limits the abuse of clock management and increases the pace of play.

Self-restarts

The panel approved allowing players to do self-restarts following minor or major foul calls outside of the critical scoring area (defined as inside the 12-meter arc and the corresponding area behind the goal), beginning with the 2016 season. Players would still have the option of waiting for the penalty to be administered.

Players called for major fouls must stand at least 4 meters behind the player with the ball on a restart, and players called for minor fouls must stand at least 4 meters to the side of the player with the ball on restarts.

As with the possession clock rule, the committee believes giving players the option of restarting play quickly can speed up the pace of play.

Stick checks

Officials will conduct stick checks of every goal-scoring stick following each goal scored, beginning next season. The rule is currently used in international play.

There will also be more extensive stick checks before the start of the game, with officials examining more than just the pocket depth.

Coaches will maintain their three stick-check requests and will be allowed to use them before any faceoff, during timeouts, at halftime and before the start of any overtime periods.

If a player is found to be using a stick that doesnít meet the specifications, that player will be given a yellow card and must serve a two-minute, non-releasable penalty.

Alternating possession

Starting next season, there will no longer be throw-ins following an offsetting foul call. Instead, an alternating possession rule will cover those scenarios. The first possession arrow will be determined at the coin toss, when the winning captains choose direction or possession.

Overtime change

In the event a game goes to overtime in 2016, teams will use a sudden-victory format and change ends every three minutes.

Previously, the team that scored the most goals in two three-minute periods won the match.

Three-second violation change

Starting in 2016, three-second violations will be considered a minor foul.

If a defender is inside the 8-meter arc and not guarding anyone for three seconds, the offensive team is given possession of the ball at the 12-meter arc, where it can initiate an indirect play (pass to a teammate) on goal.


wow shot clock makes it a very different game especially since it keeps running on shots that miss the cage.

Does clock start as soon as you touch ball or when you clear a certain point on the field?
Also, will the clock stop on a minor foul? If not, what will stop teams from minor fouling the whole way down the field to kill the shot clock. I know you will be able to quick start, but it will still kill precious seconds.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
From NCAA website:


Womenís lacrosse will have a 90-second possession clock by 2017 season

Greg Johnson | NCAA.com


Last Updated - Jul 16, 2015 17:04 EDT


A visible 90-second possession clock is coming to NCAA womenís lacrosse competition.

The NCAA Playing Rules Oversight Panel on Thursday approved adding a possession clock in the sport by the 2017 season in Division I, and by 2018 in Divisions II and III.

Delaying the implementation of the possession clock is warranted because it provides schools time to budget for any financial implications. The Womenís Lacrosse Rules Committee is recommending using two clocks, one on each end of the field. However, one clock located at the scorerís table will also be allowed.

Under the 90-second possession clock rule, the offensive team must register a shot within that window or the opposition will be awarded the ball at its location on the field when time expired.

The clock will be reset on a shot that is deflected by the goalkeeper or on a shot that hits the piping on the goal. The clock will also reset on all changes of possession and when any card has been issued to the team without possession.

The possession clock will keep counting down toward zero on shots that go wide or high of the goal.

The rules committee hopes the new rule limits the abuse of clock management and increases the pace of play.

Self-restarts

The panel approved allowing players to do self-restarts following minor or major foul calls outside of the critical scoring area (defined as inside the 12-meter arc and the corresponding area behind the goal), beginning with the 2016 season. Players would still have the option of waiting for the penalty to be administered.

Players called for major fouls must stand at least 4 meters behind the player with the ball on a restart, and players called for minor fouls must stand at least 4 meters to the side of the player with the ball on restarts.

As with the possession clock rule, the committee believes giving players the option of restarting play quickly can speed up the pace of play.

Stick checks

Officials will conduct stick checks of every goal-scoring stick following each goal scored, beginning next season. The rule is currently used in international play.

There will also be more extensive stick checks before the start of the game, with officials examining more than just the pocket depth.

Coaches will maintain their three stick-check requests and will be allowed to use them before any faceoff, during timeouts, at halftime and before the start of any overtime periods.

If a player is found to be using a stick that doesnít meet the specifications, that player will be given a yellow card and must serve a two-minute, non-releasable penalty.

Alternating possession

Starting next season, there will no longer be throw-ins following an offsetting foul call. Instead, an alternating possession rule will cover those scenarios. The first possession arrow will be determined at the coin toss, when the winning captains choose direction or possession.

Overtime change

In the event a game goes to overtime in 2016, teams will use a sudden-victory format and change ends every three minutes.

Previously, the team that scored the most goals in two three-minute periods won the match.

Three-second violation change

Starting in 2016, three-second violations will be considered a minor foul.

If a defender is inside the 8-meter arc and not guarding anyone for three seconds, the offensive team is given possession of the ball at the 12-meter arc, where it can initiate an indirect play (pass to a teammate) on goal.


wow shot clock makes it a very different game especially since it keeps running on shots that miss the cage.

Does clock start as soon as you touch ball or when you clear a certain point on the field?
so what if a player is 2 years older than your son/daughter? theyre(the parents) only doing this to their children because they kno they were never good enough for their own age, thus playing against smaller weaker kids. but when your son/daughter is playing varsity lacrosse as a freshman at 15 playing against 18 year olds, are you going to complain to the league and get them kicked off of the team? or when your child is playing college lacrosse at 19 playing against 23 year old men, are you going to complain to NCAA that its unfair that theyre in the league? No, so a 14 year old playing against a 16 year old is maybe unfair, but there is nothing you can do about it playing in a grad year tournament, instead join a U based tournament.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
so what if a player is 2 years older than your son/daughter? theyre(the parents) only doing this to their children because they kno they were never good enough for their own age, thus playing against smaller weaker kids. but when your son/daughter is playing varsity lacrosse as a freshman at 15 playing against 18 year olds, are you going to complain to the league and get them kicked off of the team? or when your child is playing college lacrosse at 19 playing against 23 year old men, are you going to complain to NCAA that its unfair that theyre in the league? No, so a 14 year old playing against a 16 year old is maybe unfair, but there is nothing you can do about it playing in a grad year tournament, instead join a U based tournament.


Actually, there is a lot that can be done about it. Because age is enforced in other sports, and it can be in lax too. As for varsity, very few kids are able to excel there till their Jr and Sr year, as it should be!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
so what if a player is 2 years older than your son/daughter? theyre(the parents) only doing this to their children because they kno they were never good enough for their own age, thus playing against smaller weaker kids. but when your son/daughter is playing varsity lacrosse as a freshman at 15 playing against 18 year olds, are you going to complain to the league and get them kicked off of the team? or when your child is playing college lacrosse at 19 playing against 23 year old men, are you going to complain to NCAA that its unfair that theyre in the league? No, so a 14 year old playing against a 16 year old is maybe unfair, but there is nothing you can do about it playing in a grad year tournament, instead join a U based tournament.


Actually, there is a lot that can be done about it. Because age is enforced in other sports, and it can be in lax too. As for varsity, very few kids are able to excel there till their Jr and Sr year, as it should be!


Don't be a tool! School and Club are two very different things. All you hold back parents need to have your heads examined. It's freaking Lacrosse!
The problem is when they are young the size difference is too much. It can lead to injuries etc. However, the part the parents are missing is that as your kid gets older the others do catch up and what was once an easy game for your child due to sheer size becomes a tougher one. I have seen some not be able to handle it.
If playing at a USL sanctioned event meant age verification was mandatory and officials were properly trained would you as a parent attend ONLY those events?
Or would you continue to support the current ones with no USL sanctioning?
I would demand that our teams played in age verified tournaments.
Can't believe that the insurance companies don't have a problem with the age thing as the above poster is right. Just like safety in the auto industry change is only going to come when the insurance companies wake up, see what's going on and then demand it. Do any insurance companies read BOTC?
Originally Posted by The Hop
If playing at a USL sanctioned event meant age verification was mandatory and officials were properly trained would you as a parent attend ONLY those events?
Or would you continue to support the current ones with no USL sanctioning?


Parents are at the mercy of their clubs and coaches. They are the ones who have to make a stand, but won't be able to business-wise unless they all do. Unfortunately, parents can't pick and choose the individual tournaments.
would just like to know how uslacrosse allows all these teams at the u15 national championship to play with all star teams. if your team is full of hold backs and repeaters of the 8th grade 2 or 3 times and u can't field a team then just stay home. just watched FCA play with kids from sweetlax, 91, madlax and turtles. just sad!!!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Can't believe that the insurance companies don't have a problem with the age thing as the above poster is right. Just like safety in the auto industry change is only going to come when the insurance companies wake up, see what's going on and then demand it. Do any insurance companies read BOTC?


It is going to take an injury then a lawsuit for insurance company to open their eyes on this subject.
Originally Posted by The Hop
If playing at a USL sanctioned event meant age verification was mandatory and officials were properly trained would you as a parent attend ONLY those events?
Or would you continue to support the current ones with no USL sanctioning?


I would prioritize those tournaments, particularly if single-year age groups. I would probably still attend some grade-based tournaments (i) in order to play superior competition, as they all have older kids, and (ii) if my team was at the bottom of a two-year age group.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
would just like to know how uslacrosse allows all these teams at the u15 national championship to play with all star teams. if your team is full of hold backs and repeaters of the 8th grade 2 or 3 times and u can't field a team then just stay home. just watched FCA play with kids from sweetlax, 91, madlax and turtles. just sad!!!


I don't see U.S. Lacrosse changing this, since 3d National and FCA have won the event multiple times. But even the World Series of Lacrosse, with it's early 5/1 cutoff, requires players to live within 100 miles of team and play regularly with them. So it can be done.

It's definitely a "first world" problem, but if you are a dedicated homegrown club that follows the U.S. Lacrosse 9/1 cutoff, you have to play older kids when you go to most tournaments. Then, when you finally get to play kids your own age in a 9/1 age-verified tournament (and U.S. Lacrosse is ONLY tournament to verify and use 9/1), you have to play all-star teams loaded with D1 commits from outside the club that you can't compete with either.
The girls lax players NEED to wear a helmet. My daughter suffered a mild concussion due to another players stick hitting in her in the head on a follow through this past spring. In years past she has had the ball hit her in the head on a pass of a bad shot. It is only a matter of time that a girl lax player will die because they do not wear protective gear for their heads.

The argument against it is ridiculous. There will not be more violence because of the helmet. It will actually make enforcing the rule easier for the official. When a stick hits a girls head it males no sound. When a stick hits a plastic helmet is makes a distinct noticeable sound. Again, my daughter has gotten hit in the head many times before the concussion incident this spring. Usually there was no penalty because the official did not realize it happened. No other protective gear should be added in order to keep the game the same.

We need to protect the heads of our young female lax players!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
I would demand that our teams played in age verified tournaments.


My son is not a holdback but I would prefer to go to tournaments where we didn't have to deal with the hassle of age verification. My son plays travel lacrosse because he enjoys it and wants to play better competition. If another team has a few older players it really doesn't matter to me it is just better competition.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
The girls lax players NEED to wear a helmet. My daughter suffered a mild concussion due to another players stick hitting in her in the head on a follow through this past spring. In years past she has had the ball hit her in the head on a pass of a bad shot. It is only a matter of time that a girl lax player will die because they do not wear protective gear for their heads.

The argument against it is ridiculous. There will not be more violence because of the helmet. It will actually make enforcing the rule easier for the official. When a stick hits a girls head it males no sound. When a stick hits a plastic helmet is makes a distinct noticeable sound. Again, my daughter has gotten hit in the head many times before the concussion incident this spring. Usually there was no penalty because the official did not realize it happened. No other protective gear should be added in order to keep the game the same.

We need to protect the heads of our young female lax players!


The argument against helmets is far from ridiculous.
Helmets do not stop concussions. They prevent contusions. Just reference football and boys lacrosse to see if helmets work. Those sports have the highest concussion rates among all contact sports.
The argument against helmets in girls lacrosse is a sound one.
While I am sorry about your daughter and her injuries I would say the number of occurrences in girls lax is by far much smaller than let's say girls soccer.
Injuries happen in sports and officiating and style of play are the reasons girls lax injuries happen.
I assume U.S. Lacrosse would include age verification in its process for registering kids with U.S. Lacrosse in the first place. Then, when you register a kid for a tournament and give his age, it would automatically check against the U.S. Lacrosse records. So would be easy for tournaments. You shouldn't even need to put age down again.
Re: concussions in girls lacrosse, it is an interesting debate. On the one hand, you have the fact that experts say helmets don't stop concussions and the fact that, like skiing, just the act of players wearing helmets may lead to more dangerous on-field behavior.

That said, I've NEVER seen a boy getting a concussion from being hit in the head with a stick. So, while a helmet may not protect against the whiplash effect common in most concussions, I am not sure it doesn't help with getting hit in the head with a stick. Now what about a ball? I've had four players get hit in the head with a ball and have concussion-like symptoms. (As did I 20 years ago, when I couldn't walk straight off the field for a few seconds and didn't have an appetite that night - luckily only possible concussion I can recall.) All were pretty mild to a point it may not even have been a concussion. (And true experts recognize that getting a concussion is not a black and white thing.) I have a hard time believing all of those shots to the head wouldn't have been worse without a helmet. I just think most research involves football helmets where you don't get checked to the head with a stick or hit in the helmet by a hard plastic ball.

PS - I'd prefer if girls lacrosse was played like boys, except with no body checking and much stricter on slashes, as well has having sticks that were like boys sticks 20 years ago. If my 4-year old girl wasn't petite, I'd have her start playing U7 with the boys next Spring.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Re: concussions in girls lacrosse, it is an interesting debate. On the one hand, you have the fact that experts say helmets don't stop concussions and the fact that, like skiing, just the act of players wearing helmets may lead to more dangerous on-field behavior.

That said, I've NEVER seen a boy getting a concussion from being hit in the head with a stick. So, while a helmet may not protect against the whiplash effect common in most concussions, I am not sure it doesn't help with getting hit in the head with a stick. Now what about a ball? I've had four players get hit in the head with a ball and have concussion-like symptoms. (As did I 20 years ago, when I couldn't walk straight off the field for a few seconds and didn't have an appetite that night - luckily only possible concussion I can recall.) All were pretty mild to a point it may not even have been a concussion. (And true experts recognize that getting a concussion is not a black and white thing.) I have a hard time believing all of those shots to the head wouldn't have been worse without a helmet. I just think most research involves football helmets where you don't get checked to the head with a stick or hit in the helmet by a hard plastic ball.

PS - I'd prefer if girls lacrosse was played like boys, except with no body checking and much stricter on slashes, as well has having sticks that were like boys sticks 20 years ago. If my 4-year old girl wasn't petite, I'd have her start playing U7 with the boys next Spring.


My kids have had concussions, one from lacrosse, two from soccer, one from basketball. We have spend the last year in treatment at the concussion clinic at St. Charles. I have discussed helmets with the doctor there, and asked about those concussion bands, and the fact is that helmets do not prevent concussions and neither do those bands. Helmets protect against skull fractures, that's it. Concussions are caused by the brain bouncing around inside the skull and that's going to happen with a hit or a fall independent of a helmet. Believe me, I'd like nothing better than a way to protect my kid's head, but a helmet is not going to do the trick. Actually, from all I've learned, you're probably better off strengthening your child's neck muscles to help stabilize the head, and maybe having a few lessons on how to protect your head in a fall.

That said, i've said for years I'd rather see the girls suit up like the boys and play a boy's style lacrosse game. I'm hoping the new shot clock helps with pacing.
Good post. I agree except for the girls playing like boys. I would think that since it's 2015 any girl can play on a boys team if she wishes. I'm not sure how many would continue though.
Originally Posted by The Hop
Good post. I agree except for the girls playing like boys. I would think that since it's 2015 any girl can play on a boys team if she wishes. I'm not sure how many would continue though.


I would love for my daughter to play the boys game. This is not allowed in public school since there is a girls version offered.
Do a better job of picking teams for school girls and U19 without politics coming into play.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Do a better job of picking teams for school girls and U19 without politics coming into play.


Agree totally.
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Do a better job of picking teams for school girls and U19 without politics coming into play.


Agree totally.


Why, what's wrong with the u19 team? they seem to be doing really well!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Also, will the clock stop on a minor foul? If not, what will stop teams from minor fouling the whole way down the field to kill the shot clock. I know you will be able to quick start, but it will still kill precious seconds.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
From NCAA website:


Womenís lacrosse will have a 90-second possession clock by 2017 season

Greg Johnson | NCAA.com


Last Updated - Jul 16, 2015 17:04 EDT


A visible 90-second possession clock is coming to NCAA womenís lacrosse competition.

The NCAA Playing Rules Oversight Panel on Thursday approved adding a possession clock in the sport by the 2017 season in Division I, and by 2018 in Divisions II and III.

Delaying the implementation of the possession clock is warranted because it provides schools time to budget for any financial implications. The Womenís Lacrosse Rules Committee is recommending using two clocks, one on each end of the field. However, one clock located at the scorerís table will also be allowed.

Under the 90-second possession clock rule, the offensive team must register a shot within that window or the opposition will be awarded the ball at its location on the field when time expired.

The clock will be reset on a shot that is deflected by the goalkeeper or on a shot that hits the piping on the goal. The clock will also reset on all changes of possession and when any card has been issued to the team without possession.

The possession clock will keep counting down toward zero on shots that go wide or high of the goal.

The rules committee hopes the new rule limits the abuse of clock management and increases the pace of play.

Self-restarts

The panel approved allowing players to do self-restarts following minor or major foul calls outside of the critical scoring area (defined as inside the 12-meter arc and the corresponding area behind the goal), beginning with the 2016 season. Players would still have the option of waiting for the penalty to be administered.

Players called for major fouls must stand at least 4 meters behind the player with the ball on a restart, and players called for minor fouls must stand at least 4 meters to the side of the player with the ball on restarts.

As with the possession clock rule, the committee believes giving players the option of restarting play quickly can speed up the pace of play.

Stick checks

Officials will conduct stick checks of every goal-scoring stick following each goal scored, beginning next season. The rule is currently used in international play.

There will also be more extensive stick checks before the start of the game, with officials examining more than just the pocket depth.

Coaches will maintain their three stick-check requests and will be allowed to use them before any faceoff, during timeouts, at halftime and before the start of any overtime periods.

If a player is found to be using a stick that doesnít meet the specifications, that player will be given a yellow card and must serve a two-minute, non-releasable penalty.

Alternating possession

Starting next season, there will no longer be throw-ins following an offsetting foul call. Instead, an alternating possession rule will cover those scenarios. The first possession arrow will be determined at the coin toss, when the winning captains choose direction or possession.

Overtime change

In the event a game goes to overtime in 2016, teams will use a sudden-victory format and change ends every three minutes.

Previously, the team that scored the most goals in two three-minute periods won the match.

Three-second violation change

Starting in 2016, three-second violations will be considered a minor foul.

If a defender is inside the 8-meter arc and not guarding anyone for three seconds, the offensive team is given possession of the ball at the 12-meter arc, where it can initiate an indirect play (pass to a teammate) on goal.


wow shot clock makes it a very different game especially since it keeps running on shots that miss the cage.

Does clock start as soon as you touch ball or when you clear a certain point on the field?


Clock starts on possession. It will continue to run during minor fouls. Goalie saves or hitting post resets clock. The new "self start" rule after minor fouls directly correlates to the new 90 second rule.

The game two years from now will not look anything like the game the next two years. Defensive riding, while an important part of the game now, will be a major factor. The days of a goalie walking up the field will be over. In fact, if I get a shot off I want it to go to the goalie!

I've seen games played with a 90 second clock (Syracuse scrimmaged using the clock). It can turn into a wild game! Officiating will also need to get up to speed.

Also throw in the new 3 second foul (12 meter non-direct)...big changes!
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Do a better job of picking teams for school girls and U19 without politics coming into play.


Agree totally.


Why, what's wrong with the u19 team? they seem to be doing really well!


We lost to Canada in the final. When you look at the number if girls the US has playing versus those in Canada, it is not even close. US Lacrosse is a sleep at the wheel - the men lose last summer's World Championship and now the U19 women lose as well. Coaching? Selection? Development?
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Do a better job of picking teams for school girls and U19 without politics coming into play.


Agree totally.


Why, what's wrong with the u19 team? they seem to be doing really well!


We lost to Canada in the final. When you look at the number if girls the US has playing versus those in Canada, it is not even close. US Lacrosse is a sleep at the wheel - the men lose last summer's World Championship and now the U19 women lose as well. Coaching? Selection? Development?


Or maybe Canada develops elite players, many of which become the top athletes on their college teams. Wasn't the loss by 1 point? I think this is good for lacrosse makes it more,exciting. Nobody wants to see the same country winni ng every year.
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by The Hop
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Do a better job of picking teams for school girls and U19 without politics coming into play.


Agree totally.


Why, what's wrong with the u19 team? they seem to be doing really well!


We lost to Canada in the final. When you look at the number if girls the US has playing versus those in Canada, it is not even close. US Lacrosse is a sleep at the wheel - the men lose last summer's World Championship and now the U19 women lose as well. Coaching? Selection? Development?


Or maybe Canada develops elite players, many of which become the top athletes on their college teams. Wasn't the loss by 1 point? I think this is good for lacrosse makes it more,exciting. Nobody wants to see the same country winni ng every year.


If it's the U.S. I do!!
Is it true that US Lacrosse approved a Sept 1 age cutoff? I would think that this would affect tournaments that require US Lacrosse registration for insurance purposes. I just got an email about it but the server is busy so I can't confirm it on the US Lacrosse website.
Soccer is going to birth year ie. 2003, 2004 etc. this fall to align with the accepted standard worldwide. Kids will be allowed to play up, but not down. This is being instituted across all age groups. As a previous poster said, it is not rocket science. Soccer players have to produce a birth certificate and a picture to create a verified player pass. Very simple. Why can't lacrosse just follow this model?
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Soccer is going to birth year ie. 2003, 2004 etc. this fall to align with the accepted standard worldwide. Kids will be allowed to play up, but not down. This is being instituted across all age groups. As a previous poster said, it is not rocket science. Soccer players have to produce a birth certificate and a picture to create a verified player pass. Very simple. Why can't lacrosse just follow this model?


Tournaments and clubs will still do whatever they want. US Lacrosse is a gutless toothless governing body.
How does U.S. Lax insurance work, are there different actuarial tables that apply to each age group? If they don't enforce their rules wouldn't there be some sort of liability?
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Soccer is going to birth year ie. 2003, 2004 etc. this fall to align with the accepted standard worldwide. Kids will be allowed to play up, but not down. This is being instituted across all age groups. As a previous poster said, it is not rocket science. Soccer players have to produce a birth certificate and a picture to create a verified player pass. Very simple. Why can't lacrosse just follow this model?


Tournaments and clubs will still do whatever they want. US Lacrosse is a gutless toothless governing body.
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