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Re: Boys 2022- PA and surrounding
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Dukes Nationals is a total money grab. The depth chart model only worked for the Dukes Club when they were the main HS club in the Philly area. With Mesa, Freedom, and HHH starting up kids went to these teams to get seen at recruiting events. Why would a 6th, 7th, or 8th grade kid who already plays for an elite club in Baltimore, PHilly, or L.I. Go play for Dukes Nationals as well? You are already going to get seen at the top recruiting tournaments. And don't give me the elite coaching, that is a Dukes National ls line for the parents wanting to brag about their son playing on a national team to bite on. If you are an elite player playing on an elite club, I think you will turn out just fine without falling for the Dukes Nationals money grab. The elite clubs haven't had a problem coaching up their kids so far as I can tell.


Total agreement.....but parents feel they must do it to keep up with the others.

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Mini camps are good workouts for 60 bucks but they loose a lot of credibility when they call it an evaluation. No numbers no clipboards. Your kid better be a hammer to get noticed at these things.

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Nothing wrong with mixing it up on a different team, no stress, different coaches and way of coaching. Meeting new kids . Getting after it with no real pressure .
If it fits in the schedule with out conflicts with HIGH PRESSURE CLUB that what the [lacrosse] does any care what these young boys want to do. Which is play lacrosse as much as possible ..

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Dukes Nationals is a total money grab. The depth chart model only worked for the Dukes Club when they were the main HS club in the Philly area. With Mesa, Freedom, and HHH starting up kids went to these teams to get seen at recruiting events. Why would a 6th, 7th, or 8th grade kid who already plays for an elite club in Baltimore, PHilly, or L.I. Go play for Dukes Nationals as well? You are already going to get seen at the top recruiting tournaments. And don't give me the elite coaching, that is a Dukes National ls line for the parents wanting to brag about their son playing on a national team to bite on. If you are an elite player playing on an elite club, I think you will turn out just fine without falling for the Dukes Nationals money grab. The elite clubs haven't had a problem coaching up their kids so far as I can tell.


Total agreement.....but parents feel they must do it to keep up with the others.


How's this "National" team do versus local teams?
Are they playing in "National" tourneys?
I'd expect them to only play on LI or Baltimore where there's their level of competition...

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So the question is: is Duke's Nationals always reppin', or just sometimes reppin'?

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Dukes Nationals is a total money grab. The depth chart model only worked for the Dukes Club when they were the main HS club in the Philly area. With Mesa, Freedom, and HHH starting up kids went to these teams to get seen at recruiting events. Why would a 6th, 7th, or 8th grade kid who already plays for an elite club in Baltimore, PHilly, or L.I. Go play for Dukes Nationals as well? You are already going to get seen at the top recruiting tournaments. And don't give me the elite coaching, that is a Dukes National ls line for the parents wanting to brag about their son playing on a national team to bite on. If you are an elite player playing on an elite club, I think you will turn out just fine without falling for the Dukes Nationals money grab. The elite clubs haven't had a problem coaching up their kids so far as I can tell.


Total agreement.....but parents feel they must do it to keep up with the others.


How's this "National" team do versus local teams?
Are they playing in "National" tourneys?
I'd expect them to only play on LI or Baltimore where there's their level of competition...


Dukes would kill all of the philly clubs except for freedom. It would come down to dukes higher overall skill level vs freedom having some team chemistry from playing together. I would give the edge to dukes by 3-4 goals

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Dukes minicamps are good. Tournament teams not so much you never know what players show up to play. This past weekend they where struggling to get players all Ny players where playing in the same tournament. I like the concept don't know if it works at the youth level.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Dukes minicamps are good. Tournament teams not so much you never know what players show up to play. This past weekend they where struggling to get players all Ny players where playing in the same tournament. I like the concept don't know if it works at the youth level.


Can you really call it a team when you have no idea who will show up at any event?

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BBL Elite beat Duke's Nationals at Harvest Classic today.

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Team 11 had a horrible day at Harvest Classic. Sankey needs to start recruiting.

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Love the helmets though i

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Coming from a friend in Long Island: Rome was not built in a day. It takes time to develop players and a team. Don't doubt that the Team 11 coaching leadership will establish an excellent lacrosse program. Marketing and recruiting is a part of youth sports, but the focus should be on the instruction and experience that a lacrosse club offers to the kids.

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The key to the club is Sankey himself. Parents will pay and invest if he coaches there kid but he isn't and that will catch up to them. They are competing with the other for profit/full time clubs like NXT, Mesa, Dukes and then dad type of programs like Freedom, Roughriders, Brotherly Love, Bucks, Rising Sons, Elevated and the list goes on.

I give it a few years and it will fizzle. There just isn't enough elite talent in Philly to support this many youth clubs and cool helmets alone with an illustrious college career isn't a sustainable model.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
The key to the club is Sankey himself. Parents will pay and invest if he coaches there kid but he isn't and that will catch up to them. They are competing with the other for profit/full time clubs like NXT, Mesa, Dukes and then dad type of programs like Freedom, Roughriders, Brotherly Love, Bucks, Rising Sons, Elevated and the list goes on.

I give it a few years and it will fizzle. There just isn't enough elite talent in Philly to support this many youth clubs and cool helmets alone with an illustrious college career isn't a sustainable model.


He was there yesterday. But you are correct there are way too many programs in the Philly area.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
The key to the club is Sankey himself. Parents will pay and invest if he coaches there kid but he isn't and that will catch up to them. They are competing with the other for profit/full time clubs like NXT, Mesa, Dukes and then dad type of programs like Freedom, Roughriders, Brotherly Love, Bucks, Rising Sons, Elevated and the list goes on.

I give it a few years and it will fizzle. There just isn't enough elite talent in Philly to support this many youth clubs and cool helmets alone with an illustrious college career isn't a sustainable model.


He was there yesterday. But you are correct there are way too many programs in the Philly area.


He has been at both tournaments we have played and all but one of the 6 skill sessions (he was honored by NC one weekend). He runs optional (for fee) Saturday offensive clinics as well and has been super communicative along with his brothers and father. Practices are run very efficiently and plenty of other coaches on hand with Pro, College and Youth experience. I have been pleasantly surprised. Some of this will undoubtedly change in the spring as he will be coaching Penn Charter.


No idea how good the team will be when all is said and done (as you indicated the dilutive effect of having so many clubs), but no doubt my son's lacrosse IQ and skill level will improve....and the sick helmet....

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Good Fall Brawl playday yesterday.
In the A division BBL, Sons, Mesa were are pretty close.
I think Sons lost to both BBL and Mesa by 1-2 goals.
Sons is improving but not quite there yet.
I think Mesa won all three and looked pretty good.
Officiating was ok and it was a well run event.
Thanks to the volunteers and promoters.

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Freedom 22 are bbest in Philly IMO

Think A Hawks, LI Express, Arden, 91 and Igloo all better though but that's really good company.


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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Freedom 22 are bbest in Philly IMO

Think A Hawks, LI Express, Arden, 91 and Igloo all better though but that's really good company.


Freedom 22 best in Philly, yes
Far from those other teams
The scores will tell the tale...

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How did Mesa do at UNC today? Looks like it was tough competition down there.

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Are any of the Philly 2022 teams going to try and qualify for WSYL?

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Are any of the Philly 2022 teams going to try and qualify for WSYL?



It is no effort to qualify. Just go to the tourney and pay. It is a B level tourney.


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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Are any of the Philly 2022 teams going to try and qualify for WSYL?



It is no effort to qualify. Just go to the tourney and pay. It is a B level tourney.



I keep reading it is a B tourney, yet every elite NY team seems to be entered as well as Diamonbacks, Breakers, BBL Elite..
is it only a B event to the teams that can't field age appropriate teams or is there another reason? Also only 4 teams out of 16 in each bracket make it to Denver seems like getting thru the qualifying would take some effort.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Are any of the Philly 2022 teams going to try and qualify for WSYL?



It is no effort to qualify. Just go to the tourney and pay. It is a B level tourney.



I keep reading it is a B tourney, yet every elite NY team seems to be entered as well as Diamonbacks, Breakers, BBL Elite..
is it only a B event to the teams that can't field age appropriate teams or is there another reason? Also only 4 teams out of 16 in each bracket make it to Denver seems like getting thru the qualifying would take some effort.


Breakers? Sorry, my mistake, it's a C Level tournament.


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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Are any of the Philly 2022 teams going to try and qualify for WSYL?



It is no effort to qualify. Just go to the tourney and pay. It is a B level tourney.



I keep reading it is a B tourney, yet every elite NY team seems to be entered as well as Diamonbacks, Breakers, BBL Elite..
is it only a B event to the teams that can't field age appropriate teams or is there another reason? Also only 4 teams out of 16 in each bracket make it to Denver seems like getting thru the qualifying would take some effort.


Breakers? Sorry, my mistake, it's a C Level tournament.



Yeah now your proving your an a** hat. Breakers beat Freedom 22 last summervFtH2d

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Are any of the Philly 2022 teams going to try and qualify for WSYL?



It is no effort to qualify. Just go to the tourney and pay. It is a B level tourney.



I keep reading it is a B tourney, yet every elite NY team seems to be entered as well as Diamonbacks, Breakers, BBL Elite..
is it only a B event to the teams that can't field age appropriate teams or is there another reason? Also only 4 teams out of 16 in each bracket make it to Denver seems like getting thru the qualifying would take some effort.


Breakers? Sorry, my mistake, it's a C Level tournament.



Yeah now your proving your an a** hat. Breakers beat Freedom 22 last summervFtH2d


I didn't even know Breakers had a 2022 team last year.

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Anyone stating that this is a B tournament must be working for Young Guns in Maryland which stands to suffer from all these good clubs going to Denver the weekend of their event.

Your missing the point this isn't WYSL for the best 2022 Team but the best U13 team. The fact that all the best clubs play 2022 and grade based we get that as that discussion has been endless. This is the WSYL saying that we need to go age based and do it right. Kudos to them for making the right decision. Anyone thinking that youth lacrosse should continue with a grade based model is simply either self serving or really dumb. My son plays for a top notch 2022 in MD and I can tell you there are 7 kids that don't make the cut off for this tournament and we aren't the only MD based team with the same issue. This is a 2023/2022 tournament and that is okay.
Last time I checked in basebal their LIttle League World Series is 100% age based .

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Anyone stating that this is a B tournament must be working for Young Guns in Maryland which stands to suffer from all these good clubs going to Denver the weekend of their event.

Your missing the point this isn't WYSL for the best 2022 Team but the best U13 team. The fact that all the best clubs play 2022 and grade based we get that as that discussion has been endless. This is the WSYL saying that we need to go age based and do it right. Kudos to them for making the right decision. Anyone thinking that youth lacrosse should continue with a grade based model is simply either self serving or really dumb. My son plays for a top notch 2022 in MD and I can tell you there are 7 kids that don't make the cut off for this tournament and we aren't the only MD based team with the same issue. This is a 2023/2022 tournament and that is okay.
Last time I checked in basebal their LIttle League World Series is 100% age based .


What makes it a B level tournament is that the majority of teams entering will get killed by 8+ goals by the 2 or 3 A level teams that enter.

The sad thing is that those 2 or 3 A level teams live at most 200 miles from each other but travel almost 2000 miles to play each other.




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They travel for the experience, the pageantry, playing at Mile High Stadium, getting dressed in the Broncos dressing room, play on ESPN in front of a national audience, to celebrate the game.

As far as your logic for being a B Level tournament because of the lack of parity your description sounds like most of the tournametns we go to and we have been to NLF, Young Guns, Hogans, NXT Cup, etc. In pool play the scores are almost always 8+ plus goals and at each grade there is ususaly 2-3 top teams. Sounds exactly what you described for WSYL.

Our last tournament this past summer we smoked every team we played in pool play, smoke the teams in quarters, and semis and got smoked in the finals ourselves. By that logic there were only 2 elite teams in the whole bracket of 2022 and they started with 4 pools.

WSYL is their third year, they will have growing pains, the last two finals have been almost unwatchable due to the blow outs, but if it can do what Little League World Series does for basebal, to lacrosse should we all be supportive. It can only help our game if they continue to move in the right direction and making this a U13 tournament aligned with the governing body of the game is a great start.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
They travel for the experience, the pageantry, playing at Mile High Stadium, getting dressed in the Broncos dressing room, play on ESPN in front of a national audience, to celebrate the game.

As far as your logic for being a B Level tournament because of the lack of parity your description sounds like most of the tournametns we go to and we have been to NLF, Young Guns, Hogans, NXT Cup, etc. In pool play the scores are almost always 8+ plus goals and at each grade there is ususaly 2-3 top teams. Sounds exactly what you described for WSYL.

Our last tournament this past summer we smoked every team we played in pool play, smoke the teams in quarters, and semis and got smoked in the finals ourselves. By that logic there were only 2 elite teams in the whole bracket of 2022 and they started with 4 pools.

WSYL is their third year, they will have growing pains, the last two finals have been almost unwatchable due to the blow outs, but if it can do what Little League World Series does for basebal, to lacrosse should we all be supportive. It can only help our game if they continue to move in the right direction and making this a U13 tournament aligned with the governing body of the game is a great start.


They need all the support they can get to pay for the airtime and the airlines and hotels need your support as well.

It better be a good experience because it is not good lacrosse.

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Why such a Debbie Downer. I would have no problem paying for airlines, hotels, and airtime to visit Denver over Fourth of July with my family.

Let's see, the four teams that have made the finals so far are NY 91, Crabs, Legacy, and Igloo. You trying to tell me those teams don't play good lacrosse.

Dude you need to get on some anti-depressants ASAP. You sound like Scrooge you must be a real joy to hang out with, comical.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Why such a Debbie Downer. I would have no problem paying for airlines, hotels, and airtime to visit Denver over Fourth of July with my family.

Let's see, the four teams that have made the finals so far are NY 91, Crabs, Legacy, and Igloo. You trying to tell me those teams don't play good lacrosse.

Dude you need to get on some anti-depressants ASAP. You sound like Scrooge you must be a real joy to hang out with, comical.


You just proved the point. 4 teams within 200 miles 3 within 20 miles. Most games were not good games at that tournament. The final was pretty good.

Why don't they have it in Hawaii? That's a more fun place to vacation than Denver.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Why such a Debbie Downer. I would have no problem paying for airlines, hotels, and airtime to visit Denver over Fourth of July with my family.

Let's see, the four teams that have made the finals so far are NY 91, Crabs, Legacy, and Igloo. You trying to tell me those teams don't play good lacrosse.

Dude you need to get on some anti-depressants ASAP. You sound like Scrooge you must be a real joy to hang out with, comical.


You just proved the point. 4 teams within 200 miles 3 within 20 miles. Most games were not good games at that tournament. The final was pretty good.

Why don't they have it in Hawaii? That's a more fun place to vacation than Denver.


I'm sitting on a beach on the 4th of July. Denver, and Colorado in general, is useless unless you're skiing/boarding.

They have it there so that it's accessible to the west coast. West coast teams won't need to travel too far to play quality teams. East coast teams dont need to travel for excellent lacrosse.

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Based upon your response I am going to guess you are fat and out of shape.

Anyone that thinks there is nothing to do in the summer in Colorado doesn't place a premium on outdoors: nature, walks camping, hiking trails, canoeing, white water rafting mounting climbing, etc. Ever hear of Rocky Mountain National Park?

Go get yourself another cheesesteak you fat f*&^

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You actually just proved my point. You my friend can only see as far as your nose. Most of these ELITE tournaments are won by the same handful of clubs from the same geographical hotbeds...sounds like WSYL?? That is NOT good for the game long term. More kids playing, more high schools adding programs, more collegiate programs, more MLL/NLL franchises IS good for the game. How do you grow the game. By having it in a huge growth area. Denver lacrosse is exploding. The moron that suggest Hawaii...don't know what you do for a living but logistics is not one of your strengths.

Get over yourself EAST coast lacrosse superiority is numbered in the game of lacrosse. California, Texas, Colorado will soon rival them. I am from the East Coast in a hotbed area and I welcome that kind of parity....you however would rather revel in your superiority in a sport that you hope remains a niche sport for the affluent so that your Johnny can look like a stud athlete and receive a fraction of a fraction of 12.5 scholarships

Either that or you work for Young Guns. Let's flip flop it... how is Young Guns going to be an elite tournament when the majority of the best 2023/2022 players are in Denver. You are right 3 of the WSYL teams that won it are within 20 miles of each other and guess what...all three are going back...so sounds to me like Young Guns will be a B/C tournament based upon your logic.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
You actually just proved my point. You my friend can only see as far as your nose. Most of these ELITE tournaments are won by the same handful of clubs from the same geographical hotbeds...sounds like WSYL?? That is NOT good for the game long term. More kids playing, more high schools adding programs, more collegiate programs, more MLL/NLL franchises IS good for the game. How do you grow the game. By having it in a huge growth area. Denver lacrosse is exploding. The moron that suggest Hawaii...don't know what you do for a living but logistics is not one of your strengths.

Get over yourself EAST coast lacrosse superiority is numbered in the game of lacrosse. California, Texas, Colorado will soon rival them. I am from the East Coast in a hotbed area and I welcome that kind of parity....you however would rather revel in your superiority in a sport that you hope remains a niche sport for the affluent so that your Johnny can look like a stud athlete and receive a fraction of a fraction of 12.5 scholarships

Either that or you work for Young Guns. Let's flip flop it... how is Young Guns going to be an elite tournament when the majority of the best 2023/2022 players are in Denver. You are right 3 of the WSYL teams that won it are within 20 miles of each other and guess what...all three are going back...so sounds to me like Young Guns will be a B/C tournament based upon your logic.


You have no clue what so ever. The three teams going to Denver are good teams but do you think that for one minute that without them Young Guns will be a B/C tournament? You are sadly mistaken. That tournament will continue to be an AA tournament without your 3 little precious teams from NY. Get over yourself, reach down and gram both ears and pull real hard.
Time you see the light of day.

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Based on the teams already committed to and listed on the Young Guns website, it will be one of the better tournaments of the summer, right behind Millon's Natl. Championship. That tournament has all the best teams from LI and MD with a few other sprinkled in. WSYL will be a great experience, but not the best competition.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Based upon your response I am going to guess you are fat and out of shape.

Anyone that thinks there is nothing to do in the summer in Colorado doesn't place a premium on outdoors: nature, walks camping, hiking trails, canoeing, white water rafting mounting climbing, etc. Ever hear of Rocky Mountain National Park?

Go get yourself another cheesesteak you fat f*&^


No one is going out there to walk, camp, hike,canoe, rock climb, etc.

They are going trophy hunting to beat up on weak teams and then have 1 or 2 competitive games.


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Ahhh...... Just as I suspected, your all about the Young Guns. Your true agenda finally comes out.

the only "pulling" going on around here is you reaching for your Johnson and grafitying yourself on what a great tournament youre going to, go grab another sausage and peppers on a hoagie roll...fat boy...Colorado...nothing to do... outside...unbelievable.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
You actually just proved my point. You my friend can only see as far as your nose. Most of these ELITE tournaments are won by the same handful of clubs from the same geographical hotbeds...sounds like WSYL?? That is NOT good for the game long term. More kids playing, more high schools adding programs, more collegiate programs, more MLL/NLL franchises IS good for the game. How do you grow the game. By having it in a huge growth area. Denver lacrosse is exploding. The moron that suggest Hawaii...don't know what you do for a living but logistics is not one of your strengths.

Get over yourself EAST coast lacrosse superiority is numbered in the game of lacrosse. California, Texas, Colorado will soon rival them. I am from the East Coast in a hotbed area and I welcome that kind of parity....you however would rather revel in your superiority in a sport that you hope remains a niche sport for the affluent so that your Johnny can look like a stud athlete and receive a fraction of a fraction of 12.5 scholarships

Either that or you work for Young Guns. Let's flip flop it... how is Young Guns going to be an elite tournament when the majority of the best 2023/2022 players are in Denver. You are right 3 of the WSYL teams that won it are within 20 miles of each other and guess what...all three are going back...so sounds to me like Young Guns will be a B/C tournament based upon your logic.


You have no clue what so ever. The three teams going to Denver are good teams but do you think that for one minute that without them Young Guns will be a B/C tournament? You are sadly mistaken. That tournament will continue to be an AA tournament without your 3 little precious teams from NY. Get over yourself, reach down and gram both ears and pull real hard.
Time you see the light of day.


Not worth talking to his guy, his son is probably one of the Crabs 14 yr old 2023's. Life is about experience's any team can go to Young Guns. Denver for most is a 1 shot deal, why not go? Please don't compare back water MD were the tournament is to Denver either.

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Time you see the light of day. I went to Young Guns last year and it was a good tournament but lets not pretend it competes with a NLF or NXT Cup type of event.
We played in the 2024 AA bracket and there was only 5 teams last year. NOT GOOD. 5 teams barely makes a viable bracket Summer of 2016

This is what you will see in 2017:
2025 Maybe 6 teams at best...only 5 last year.
2024 Tops 10 Teams
2023 Diluted because alot of the older 2023 kids will be in Denver
2022 Diluted because the top teams will be in Denver or oldest kids
2021 Good
2020 Good

Stopped at 9th grade since the focus is youth. Does that look like a kick butt AA Tournament to you? Don't believe it look it up. Their committed teams for 2017 is way behind what it was same time last year. Also, intereting is the names that aren't there specifically at 2023/2022


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